This week Bellevue deacons, some members of the choir, members of Joe Jernigan's class, and perhaps others received this anonymous letter.While I think if you're going to send a letter to someone by mail you should have the courage to sign your name, that's really not the issue here. I have no idea at all who wrote it. I can't even guess based upon the writing style, and besides, it's likely someone I don't know. But instead of criticizing the author for not signing his or her name or for sending it in the first place, why not critique the content of the letter itself? As someone so appropriately pointed out, we don't know who wrote the book of Hebrews either, but that doesn't diminish the value of what it says.
The sermon archives can be accessed here.
800 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 401 – 600 of 800 Newer› Newest»Miss Billie kneeads too perchus a goode spel chek programme fer hir commputir. And, moore impertuntly, she kneads too remuv th blindrs frum hir eyes!
Conernedsbcer
Start to worry when you DO understand Miss Billie. :)
BBCCC wrote:
"OK let go ahead and say JA and SG broke one of the 10 commandments. I guess those acts are ok with some people."
Oh, just say it! Unless the tapes have been doctored, he lied, pure and simple.
"Also for the record perjury is a lie reguardless if you are under oath or not."
Not in any dictionary I consulted, but I could be wrong.
Lynn wrote:
"Lynn is my real name."
Not to be confused with "Lin."
On August 5, Rev. Scotty Shows facilitated the now infamous soccer coaches meeting. To say the least, he was rude, abrupt, condescending, and he was vague in many of his responses.
Scotty stated that EVERY coach had to sign the Coach Covenant AND Leadership Covenant “as-is” without any modifications if they wanted to coach at Bellevue.
Some EXISTING COACHES lined through wording they objected to on one or both of the covenants, and they inserted other wording. However, there were several coaches who asked if they could modify some of the wording, and they were told NO by Scotty Shows, the Recreation staff, and/or David Coombs.
It has been almost a month, and there are still some coaches on the field who have NOT signed BOTH Covenants WITHOUT modifications. Yet, other men and women who refused to sign the Steve Gaines Pledge of Allegiance were fired. Oooohhhh Scottttttyyyy, you got some ‘splaining to do!
billie said:
I am really not trying to be arrogant just answering one of your silly statements.
sotl says:
LOLOLOL!! NO! Why, we would NEVER think that YOU would EVER be arrogant!!!
With kind statements like this one, no one would EVER accuse YOU of being arrogant!
To whom it may concern:
I am looking for my brother, a 6 foot 3 inch inhumanly hairy man who weighs about 100 pounds, regularly jogs half naked, has a birth defect that looks like a tail, has an affinity for rancid meats and is known to operate an illegal medical practice, primarily in the area of liposuction, using 'medical tools' that can be found at any pawn shop or hardware store.
I have recently returned from a 3-5 year vacation, and his upstairs garage apartment landlady hasn't seen or heard from him in several weeks, though his station wagon jalopy is still parked in front of her house. She informed me that he has visited here from time to time, and I was hoping that someone here may be able to help me in locating him. I just hope that idiot hasn't tried to mail himself somewhere in a box again.
If any should hear from him, inform him that I will be staying in his little stinkhole apartment, and that he can expect upon his return the usual brotherly beating that I administer to him whenever I am released, or should I say, back from vacation.
Phel Loney
Piglet said:
Concernedsbcer
Start to worry when you DO understand Miss Billie. :)
oc says:
yeah, what Piglet said.
One other thing...would someone ask that genius why he has a barrel of radioactive waste in his living room?...it's no wonder why Mama Loney made him sleep under the porch.
Phel Loney
New BBC Open Forum said...
Lynn wrote:
"Lynn is my real name."
Not to be confused with "Lin."
11:13 PM, September 01, 2007
NASS, I caught that earlier :).
Phel,
I saw your boney, hairy brother at a rendering plant in Horn Lake Ms. He was begging the supervisor for a job and lunch. I think he got the lunch.
just sayin'.
oc.
Gotta be under oath to commit perjury. However, that's man's law....I'm more afraid of lying before God. For those in church leadership positions, be very afraid. You will be held to a higher standard. *See James
Housewife,
Good response.....
the others on here have the quick minds.....they will come up with something catchy! I just want you to have a blog name more suited to your personality rather than your current "job status"!!
Cakes,
What I expected from you, sweet cakes...you do exude ?? compassion!(I have no spell check for the blog...it disappeared)
Those kids you are teaching are being impacted forever by your compassion and talent!
bbc_observations,
FINALLY we hear something more about this!!! The silence has been a big elephant!! Thanks for some update on that situation!
Interesting that on contracts it is acceptable to draw a line thru a printed statement and make changes....but not at bbc.
I wish everyone would leave Ms. Billie alone.
What more can be said if the PW sexual abuse issue is a moutain we have made of a mole hill to her???
It was the child of one very honorable man (who worked tirelessly towards restoration)
who said...daddy, what are we going to do about this????
It was my son
(while still in his rebellious stage)
who called me from his car.... upset that people from BBC were calling into the Mike Flemming show (at Christmas break)....
his outrage was that people would say
this happened 17 years ago...and that they would dare to insinuate that his beloved Bro R. knew and did nothing.....
He said to ME that day....
don't people know even if it WAS one time, that's one too many to be a minister???!!!
So the regular folks ..the little people...DO know how to distinguish mole hills from moutains and lies from truth.
...out of the mouth of babes......
whoever would be desensitized to this mountain issue of sexual abuse ...much less by clergy.... has become deaf and blind.
no point to discuss any other issues. JMO
bbc observations...
Just a thought...Seems to me that any active coach that was allowed to modify the contract (Contrary to common wisdom, an informal exchange of promises can still be binding and legally as valid as a written contract - thus the hold harmless section which the church will hide behind if they deem it necessary) had better have a copy of the same contract signed by SG or DC, indicating that the church agrees to the other parties changes. If a coach doesn't have that then he signed the agreement as is. After all, as you said, SS, others and DC made it clear that modifications to the contract were not acceptable.
Another note, SHAME on the coaches that - seem to - have gotten what they wanted but won't stand with those who were refused.
For those who signed the contract with modifications, they might want to check with a lawyer to determine what rights they really signed over.
Happy Sunday everyone.
"I am really not trying to be arrogant just answering one of your silly statements."
Miss Billie, Why not answer the hard questions we have asked you over and over about 1 Timothy 2, your pastor, PW and why scripture was ignored in that situation?
Why? Because you can't without admitting your pastor ignored scripture. Or, perhaps he just does not know it.
You have been presented with Biblical truth over and over here and have CHOSEN to ignore it.
Lin-my real name
"Question for all: Does God hear the prayers of someone who continuously and willfully ignores His Holy Word even when they have been shown the truth over and over?"
No. Isaiah 1
10:46 PM, September 01, 2007
Ez, That is some hard teaching. No wonder so many turned away from Jesus when He said we must drink His Blood and eat His Flesh if we are to follow Him.
15When you spread out your hands,
I will hide my eyes from you;
even though you make many prayers,
I will not listen;
your hands are full of blood.
16 Wash yourselves; make yourselves clean;
remove the evil of your deeds from before my eyes;
cease to do evil,
17learn to do good;
seek justice,
correct oppression;
bring justice to the fatherless,
plead the widow’s cause.
Psalm 66: 18
If I had cherished iniquity in my heart, the Lord would not have listened.
Isaiah 59
1Behold, the LORD’s hand is not shortened, that it cannot save,
or his ear dull, that it cannot hear;
2 but your iniquities have made a separation
between you and your God,
and your sins have hidden his face from you
so that he does not hear.
Miss Billie, This is how important scripture is to those who follow Christ:
4But He answered and said, "It is written, 'MAN SHALL NOT LIVE ON BREAD ALONE, BUT ON EVERY WORD THAT PROCEEDS OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD.'"
gmommy said:
So the regular folks ..the little people...DO know how to distinguish mole hills from moutains and lies from truth.
...out of the mouth of babes......
SOTL says:
Didn't you mean to say, " FOKES"
Dear Nass: The blog has been no fun today!!!! We miss you when you are out on the lake and we have to have moderation.
One (or two) bad apples spoiling the bunch......
:(
Unity? Unity? Unity?
Ex 32:26then Moses stood in the gate of the camp and said, "Who is on the LORD’s side? Come to me." And all the sons of Levi gathered around him. 27And he said to them, "Thus says the LORD God of Israel, 'Put your sword on your side each of you, and go to and fro from gate to gate throughout the camp, and each of you kill his brother and his companion and his neighbor.'"
This happened right after Moses broke the first set of the 10 Commandments. Arron had made the golden calf and all Israel was rioting. The mention of the swords and how the levites use them to divide the people….”Who is on the Lords side?” got me to thinking of:
Matt 10:34 "Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. 36 And a person’s enemies will be those of his own household.
And Luke 12:51 Do you think that I have come to give peace on earth? No, I tell you, but rather division. 52For from now on in one house there will be five divided, three against two and two against three. 53They will be divided, father against son and son against father, mother against daughter and daughter against mother, mother-in-law against her daughter-in-law and daughter-in-law against mother-in-law."
Then when we look at the SWORD…the WORD….JESUS
Eph 6:14 17and take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God, 18praying at all timesin the Spirit, with all prayer and supplication.
Heb 12:11Let us therefore strive to enter that rest, so that no one may fall by the same sort of disobedience. 12For the word of God is living and active, sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing to the division of soul and of spirit, of joints and of marrow, and discerning the thoughts and intentions of the heart. 13And no creature is hidden from his sight, but all are naked and exposed to the eyes of him to whom we must give account.
Was it an accident that Jesus met with Moses and Elijah on the mountain?
Mark 9:44And there appeared to them Elijah with Moses, and they were talking with Jesus.
All three had the same message. It was a message of division.
Moses…Ex 32:26then Moses stood in the gate of the camp and said, "Who is on the LORD’s side? Come to me."
Elija….1 Kings 18: 21And Elijah came near to all the people and said, "How long will you go limping between two different opinions?
If the LORD is God, follow him; but if Baal, then follow him."
Jesus….Mat 12:30 Whoever is not with me is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.
The wheat and the tares are growing together, going to "church together". Is it really any wonder that we will have divisions within this "family"?
Seeing Steve Gaines advertise for his Holy Land gig in the middle of the church service just prior to his sermon is sickening. Since he has admitted to making money in the past and he still benefits financilaly off of the trips, I wonder if anyone else in the church could purchase advertising time or be given advertising time for favors. Perhaps we'll see an Arnold Fisher commercial soon in the service for anyone needing engineering work.
Matthew 21
12: Then Jesus went into the temple of God and drove out all those who bought and sold in the temple, and overturned the tables of the money changers and the seats of those who sold doves.
13: And He said the them. "It is written, 'My house shall be called a house of prayer, but you have made it a den of thieves.'"
sickofthelies said...
Billie,
Please elaborate on your statement about how we are making a mountain out of a molehill with regard to PW.
Are you of the opinion that not all sexual abuse is bad? Is some worse than others? Is it ok sometimes?
YOU are the one that accused us of making a mountain out of a molehill, now explain what you meant.
10:51 PM, September 01, 2007
Sickofthelies,
I never said that the PW thing was a molehill. I said the PW case was not the issue it was a horrible offense. I said that I believe, along with many others that Brother Steve did NOT ignore the Scripture,that he was just as shocked as I when he was told. I stated that I believe his statement and I do not have a problem with the decision that he made considering that he was a new pastor to BBC and given the fact that the offense happened over 17 years ago under the leadership of Dr. Rogers. I am NOT saying that I believe Dr. Rogers knew what had happened. To blame Brother Steve for allowing a minister to stay on staff, a minister that Dr. Rogers considered a personal friend and one that Dr. Rogers brought to BBC from Florida is foolish. Wbo would have dreamed that it was possible for Dr. Rogers to be fooled for over 17 years by PW?
"To condem Brother Gaines, for assuming that the matter had been dealt with years before his arrival, is making a mountain out of a molehill" equals to capitalizing off the PW case just to build the case that the anti Gaines crowd had already began.
The one and only true offense that any of you have is the PW situation that is why all of you keep bringing it to the surface, however the only thing our pastor is guilty of is assuming something based upon the integrity of Dr. Rogers to run a tight ship. No, PW should not have remained on staff but based upon the information Brother Steve was given, at the time, he made a justifiable decision.
I have stated all of this before BUT some people are so concerned about proper grammar and spelling of words they do not hear with their ears.
I have lived long enough to know that this world is filled with a lot of educated fools who couldn't share the simple truth of the gospel if their lives depended on it. The best way to spot these people is to write them a message with a few mistakes and their veins will pop out and they will mock you. There is something about demons that demonstrates their love of mockery, I guess it makes them feel good about themselves. They loved to mock Jesus!
I'd rather listen to a preacher who loves Jesus with awful grammar than to one who speaks with proper grammar with an agenda to destroy the ministry of one of God's servants under the pretence of doing God's will.
What is amazing is the fact that many of you are busy warning others to be aware of false teaching and false prophets but without a clue that they are actually supporting their evil works.
I will end with this:
"Jesus Christ is LORD"
I will praise HIS NAME as long as I live and thank Him for bringing Dr. Steve Gaines to BBC. He has taught me the joy that comes from singing praises to God from my heart. I wish you could experience the joy!
Billie
If u fok can t un d stnd the pre v us post I w'll b hap e 2 x pla n.
Ms. Billie,
I can agree with you that the PW matter is not THE issue, rather it is the result and the evidence of a mindset and a frame of reference which is far outside the bounds of scriptural instruction. The PW matter is one more in a long line of decisions and actions which not only defy any type of sensible logic, but are in direct conflict with the clear teachings of Scripture. The fact that this incident happened 17 yrs ago under someone else's ministry is irrelevant. To borrow a quote from Harry Truman, "the buck stops here". The fact remains that the information came to light under the current pastor's watch, therefore the "buck" stops there. The Scriptures are quite clear as to the qualifications of gospel ministry...they are not mere "guidelines". I, and I'm sure many others find it hard to believe that a pastor with a PhD and twenty years of pastoral experience would find himself in "uncharted waters" in this matter. Especially given that this pastor has a record of firing staff members on grounds of immorality...and not 6 months after the fact.
Scripturally, the responsibility for matters of doctrine and discipline ultimately lie with the church as a BODY...a principle which seems to be lost on the current administration, and has been ignored, twisted, and excused on the basis of the size of the church, or the "fear of reprisals" against those who have disagreed with the way things have/are being done at BBC. When all power is given to a select few in the church, it is a step back towards Rome, and a complete denial of the Scriptural description of Christ's body as being a "kingdom and priests"...the doctrine of the priesthood of all believers is not only a Baptist doctrine, but one which was brought to the forefront in the Reformation to declare to the priests, cardinals and the pope of the Roman Catholic church, that they had no Biblical right to hold the church and the consciences of the people captive to their own foolish traditions and superstitions.
In closing, Ms. Billie, I will repeat that PW is not THE issue, but it is certainly no small matter, as neither are the many other fiascoes which have taken place over the last two years. I'm sure you are quite sincere in your views on this and other matters, but sincerity does not equate to being right.
Billie,
The law states that an individual who learns of a case of childhood sexual abuse is to report it--no matter when it occured.
The reason is that it is not in anyone's perview to know if the abuser is still abusing. Futhermore, statistics suggest that a pedophile doesn't just stop, without intervention. Didn't the pedophile "council" folks for years, all of whom I;m sure needed a soul shower after the dude was outed?
What Dr. Rogers did regarding the pedophile, in the absense of his knowledge of his secret, has no bearing on the decision of Gaines to keep the secret, once revealed to him.
You can sanctify blissful ignorance and loyalty all day long, but please don't saddle your Savior with your own poor logic and judgement.
billie said
To blame Brother Steve for allowing a minister to stay on staff, a minister that Dr. Rogers considered a personal friend and one that Dr. Rogers brought to BBC from Florida is foolish. Wbo would have dreamed that it was possible for Dr. Rogers to be fooled for over 17 years by PW?
1:24 AM, September 03, 2007
Again with the backhanded slap against AR. Can't you people defend SG without even veiled insults AR? You really can't, can you? Doesn't that tell you something?
a minister that Dr. Rogers considered a personal friend and one that Dr. Rogers brought to BBC from Florida is foolish. Wbo would have dreamed that it was possible for Dr. Rogers to be fooled for over 17 years by PW?
Veiled insults... as if considering him a personal friend and bringing him in from FL meant that AR wouldn't have dealt with him swiftly and severely just the same. That's something SG failed to do.
however the only thing our pastor is guilty of is assuming something based upon the integrity of Dr. Rogers to run a tight ship. No, PW should not have remained on staff but based upon the information Brother Steve was given, at the time, he made a justifiable decision.
Nice try. The problem with your "explanation" is that it took how long to get rid of PW?!? He didn't get rid of him when it became clear that AR didn't know. If that's what you're hinging your defense on, it just went out the window because SG should have fired him the minute he realized AR didn't know. But SG didn't do that did he? NO!
Then he suspends him WITH pay? How sweet! The guy already confessed! That should have been enough to fire him. But no! Let's give the man his salary because God's money being wasted by an admitted pedophile is such a great testimony.
The only reason he finally got rid of him having waited as long as he did was because the outcry became too loud and oh yea - let's not forget the criminal liability! Sorry PW. SG tried to cover for you long enough but the law put too much heat on him. SG decided that in light of this, you're no longer as necessary as he thought. Too bad. You would have made a great crony, especially if you now owed SG your life. =(
based upon the integrity of Dr. Rogers to run a tight ship.
You're still trying to put this on the back of AR as if he was the one who failed to take care of it and SG had to mop up the mess.
There is something about demons that demonstrates their love of mockery, I guess it makes them feel good about themselves. They loved to mock Jesus!
That's funny. I wasn't aware that you were Jesus. They weren't mocking Jesus; they were mocking you! Are you now claiming to be Jesus?
I'd rather listen to a preacher who loves Jesus with awful grammar than to one who speaks with proper grammar with an agenda to destroy the ministry of one of God's servants under the pretence of doing God's will.
It would be better if you wanted to listen to a preacher who doesn't twist Scripture to bring about his own agenda to destroy and beat up his flock. But hey! I guess the only thing that matters is that his "sermons" make you feel good. Forget that Scripture is being violated. You're entitled to your warm fuzzies.
BTW, he's not God's servant if keeps spitting on God's Word. SG should be preaching it as God wrote it, not as is most convenient to him. And this is another one of SG's grave sins to add to the PW case. But you'll ignore it too.
He has taught me the joy that comes from singing praises to God from my heart. I wish you could experience the joy!
Are you saying that you didn't know about this joy before SG came to town? Are you saying you never learned how to praise when Bro. Whitmire was leading the worship? Are you saying that you didn't know how to praise God from the heart when AR was pastor? Do I smell another backhanded slap at AR? Man. I bet you didn't even insult AR consciously. You people have become so dependent on bringing down AR in order to lift SG up that now, you seem to do it in your sleep. Impressive. 2 points for also insulting Bro. Whitmire.
BTW, we had joy at BBC before SG killed it.
And finally, this gem:
The one and only true offense that any of you have is the PW situation that is why all of you keep bringing it to the surface
That's not the only grave sin SG had committed against BBC. You just choose to ignore the rest!!
Maybe we should shoot off another list to billie that she will also ignore.
Here's a start:
sickofthelies said...
Steve Gaines climbs a fence...he's the victim
Steve Gaines lies about the size of the fence, he's the victim
Steve Gaines goes to Union City, TN and slams his own sheep....he's the victim
Steve Gaines calls Mark Sharpe
"Hezbollah", he's the victim
Steve Gaines, refusing to preach on Wednesday nights so that he can spend time with his family, only two nights later to go to another church ( on a wed. night) and preach for $$$$ .....he's the victim
Steve Gaines allowing a confessed sexual pervert to remain on staff...he's the victim
Steve Gaines refusing to follow Matthew 18, he's the victim
Steve Gaines fleecing his own sheep with trips to the Holy Land, he's the victim
Steve Gaines refuses to follow State Law in releasing financial information , he's the victim
Steve reportedly makes close to $500,000 in salary...but let's cut it in half, just for the sake of arguement..he's the victim..
Poor Steve.
6:35 PM, August 30, 2007
I hope that all here will pray that the Lord will take away Miss Billie's delusion and that He will illuminate His truth to her when she reads scripture.
The more she writes, the more overwhelmed I am with sadness of what is happening in Christendom. People are making up their own Jesus, ignoring and twisting the Word to fit their worldview and it is going on everywhere.
She is to be pitied. She has refused the truth of clear scripture teaching that has repeatedly been shown to her. That is very serious. She would rather follow a man she finds 'charismatic'.
She really believes that her pastor loves Jesus. But one cannot love Jesus and continually ignore and twist His Word.
Lin wrote:
"I hope that all here will pray that the Lord will take away Miss Billie's delusion... "
And/or the key to the gate. Amen.
I am still waiting for a blog name more suited to our spunky truth seeker "house wife"...
Lin,
Scary and an eye opener concerning whether God hears the prayers of those that willfully ignore the Truth of God's Word......
how does that affect the "prayer legacy" that SG believes he is bringing to BBC???
what is the significance of having people pray over empty chairs???
I love your post allofgrace...
just wish none on our blog would ever use the word used by the BBC leadership to describe sexual abuse. Makes me cringe.
Billie, Billie, Billie,
SIGH. Bless your heart.
Billie said this:
"I said that I believe, along with many others that Brother Steve did NOT ignore the Scripture,that he was just as shocked as I when he was told."
*****
So, let me make sure I am understanding you. You are saying that he was shocked...
WAS HE SHOCKED FOR THE ENTIRE SIX MONTHS?
********
And then, incredibly, you stated this:
"I believe his statement and I do not have a problem with the decision that he made considering that he was a new pastor to BBC and given the fact that the offense happened over 17 years ago under the leadership of Dr. Rogers. "
Ahhh, so now, you choose to ignore the fact that there is no such thing as a reformed pedophile. EVEN IF he was not PRESENTLY molesting a child, a pedophile should NEVER EVER be left alone with children. DO YOU GET THIS????
It does not matter HOW LONG AGO IT WAS!!!!!
And please help me to understand why you want to bring Dr. R. into this. Was Dr. R. at this man's house? Was he in the room when the molestation happened?
To minimize this CRIME by saying that since he was a friend of Dr. R. he must be ok is just NOTHING BUT ignorance.
OH, and then this gem:
" he was a new pastor to BBC"
Billie, you CONVENIENLTY ignore the fact that he might have been new to BBC, BUT he had 20 YEARS of experience as a pastor. The man has a PHD for the love of Pete!
I have NO Experience as a pastor AND I do not have a PHD, BUT I would have thrown the pervert out on his Kiester!!!!
And then Billie went into this diatribe:
"To blame Brother Steve for allowing a minister to stay on staff, a minister that Dr. Rogers considered a personal friend and one that Dr. Rogers brought to BBC from Florida is foolish. Wbo would have dreamed that it was possible for Dr. Rogers to be fooled for over 17 years by PW?"
NO, Billie, what was foolish is the fact that he allowed an ADMITTED pedophile to stay on staff. All this about Dr. R. has absolutely nothing to do with it.
Help me out here, was Dr. R. sitting in the room when he confessed that he was a pervert?
I bet PW knew a lot of influential people. Does that mean that you allow the pervert to continue his terror against children? This is just babble...You are grasping at straws.
Next, Billie made this ridiculous statement:
"The one and only true offense that any of you have is the PW situation that is why all of you keep bringing it to the surface,"
Billie...this is absolutely incredible for you to say such a thing!!! You have MINIMIZED this crime.. " THAT PW SITUATION" as YOU refer to it was a CRIME!! Do you get that????? A child was hurt physically, spiritually, emotionally. Yet, you just refer to it as though all PW did was jaywalk. This statement is compatible with " making a mountain ouf of a molehill". May God keep you away from all children if you just brush it off as nothing.
And then there was this:
" only thing our pastor is guilty of is assuming something based upon the integrity of Dr. Rogers to run a tight ship"
There you go again, Billie...how does Dr. Roger's integrity play into this? The man is dead and buried, and you keep slapping him across the face. Dr. Adrian Rogers had more integrity in his little finger than SG has in his entire body!!!
I almost fell out of my chair when I read this:
"No, PW should not have remained on staff but based upon the information Brother Steve was given, at the time, he made a justifiable decision."
Billie, what part of " I AM A PERVERT AND I MOLESTED MY OWN CHILD" did SG not understand????
You make one pathetic, twisted excuse after the other. It's painful to watch as you twist and contort yourself to explain away ALL of SG's sins.
Here's the TRUTH. Can you handle it?
Paul Williams confessed to Steve Gaines that he was/is a pervert and Steve Gaines just shrugged his shoulders, sent him right back out to do his job at the church, to victimize women and children some more.
This is what your hero did, Billie. Deal with it.
What we have with Billie Tapp, fokes, is a COMPLETE absence of LOGIC and CRITICAL THINKING.
What is scarey is that she is not alone in that huge building that was once Bellevue Baptist Church.
What is even scarier is that these people VOTE!!!
If it were not for Miss Billie, the blog wouldn't have any thing to discuss.
Lin,
You are so right Lin, and this is what is so sad...the inability of people like Miss Billie to recognize false teachers. We must all be in prayer for her and others like her. There is no point in arguing and it is wrong to keep the strife going. They simply cannot see it. It is biblical. They are delusional. We must love these people. I know it is hard...but it is what we must do.
Lin: You are so right. I am saddened almost daily with the misconceptions "out there." I talk to people who only have "been taught" one side of God's character, who don't study for themselves, who don't "hunger and thirst" for His Word, and righteousness.
Yesterday our pastor mentioned death and the brevity of life, and I couldn't help thinking, "Come, Lord Jesus, I am ready." But it makes my heart break at how many will not make that trip because they have been deceived. The false teaching has so permeated the denominations as a whole. If one person has been inspired by this blog to study for themselves, it will have been worth it. However, I am praying that more have. God has given all the answers we need. We just have to look.
"Amazed" makes a good point. I don't agree with it, but the attention Ms. Billie has garnered the last couple of days is unmerited and might make it seem that way to the new observer. Ms. Billie's comments are what they are. They speak for themselves. Let's move on....
Amazed: That might because people like Ms. Billie accentuate the problems.
amazed,
Since quoting Scripture, theological discussions, and analyzing Ms. Billie's comments aren't what you consider appropriate topics of discussion, what would you like to see us discuss?
Happy Labor Day everybody!!
Now go get out your BBQ grill and spend some time with your family!
NBBCOF,
My name is not amazed, but I'd love to see someone lead a discussion on this:
Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. (KJV)
"Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them." (KJV)
Many don't know doctrine; that's the problem. I know I'm still learning everyday but I think I have a handle on the basics. Some refuse to study and look at the whole picture. What can be done?
amazed said:
If it were not for Miss Billie, the blog wouldn't have any thing to discuss
oc says:
Miss Billie is just the recent distraction. A detour, so to speak. A break from the most serious issues we have all been dealing with. As long as these issues persist, I believe good people like those represented on this blog will continue to challenge the status quo. And why should it be otherwise?
Should sin have it's way in BBC and the SBC and Christendom in general? Shall we just sit down and watch the show and say nothing, and with our silence, sin by omission? Are we not then condoning the apostacy? Are we not then giving our 'amen' to sin?
Yes, there are plenty of things to discuss, and sometimes rabbits are chased. Miss Billie is the apparently the most
recent 'rabbit'. Sometimes those rabbits are chased in an effort to get away from the pain, just for a little relief, just for a little while. Sometimes those rabbits are chased because they ARE part of the pain. So on further thinking, maybe Miss Billie represents a target for the pain of many. The pain many of us have for others, people like Miss Billie, who will just not see. So frustration comes, and it looks like anger and it multiplies,because we know of so many others who also will not see.
Let's pray for all the Billies.
And let's move on.
Just ramblin' thoughts.
oc.
Billie, Billie, Billie,
SIGH. Bless your heart.
Billie said this:
"I said that I believe, along with many others that Brother Steve did NOT ignore the Scripture,that he was just as shocked as I when he was told."
*****
So, let me make sure I am understanding you. You are saying that he was shocked...
WAS HE SHOCKED FOR THE ENTIRE SIX MONTHS?
********
Sickofthelies,
For a group of people who are so eager to keep things in the context from which they are written you certainly do take statements out of context and use them to confuse other people.
Once again!! Based upon the situation and the information, which you do NOT know, was given to Brother Steve, I believe that the decision he made was justifiable. Hindsight says the decision was NOT the correct decision but an understandable mistake for which Brother Steve has more than suffered enough. He has learned some very painful lessons but haven't we all, "been there" and he has done NOTHING worthy of having to leave the ministry. God HAS NOT called any of you to participate in the, "organized crime against our pastor" Yes! many are refering to the blogsters, the savingbellevue website and the IDC as, "satan's organized crime against Dr. Steve Gaines" I agree with them.
Think about this:
Place yourself for a few moments as satan. What would be the best scheme you could come up with to destroy a man who God is using to bring a body of Christ into the next generation. IF you will do this you can easily see the reason for this new organization of, "believers"
The head (satan) knows his fate. He doesn't stand a chance against the STONE aimed for him. The best way for false prophets and teachers to get to God's man is through organized religion.Think about who was out to get Jesus.
We are living in a day of great confusion for the body of Christ but those who are faithful will come through refined like pure gold.
How do you know, without a shadow of doubt, that you are NOT in the middle of, "organized crime" gainst God's Son?
Remember Judas, kissed Jesus, he pretended to be a man of peace but all know that he had actually became a member of, "organized crime" who claimed to be perfectly keeping the laws of God.
Personally, I'll stay with the teachings that have more than proven themselves to me over the past 50 years which are exactly what our new pastor teaches. To call Brother Steve a false teacher is placing a multitude of people, teachers, pastors, friends, family members in the same category and this woman who you all so graciously love to call crazy, knows better.
I ask myself why I bother to talk with any of you because you just don't, "get it" then I remember some things in my past that I didn't get until much later in my life and also when I did, "get it" I remembered those who tried so endlessly to help me understand and today I love those people because I realized they really did care.
I do care and my hope is someday you will realize it.
Billie
gmommy said...
I am still waiting for a blog name more suited to our spunky truth seeker "house wife"...
Gmommy, dear, not to fuss, but what exactly is your problem with one being proud enough of that noble profession to identify herself by it? Is being known as a grandmother that much better?
Just wondering why this name bugs you so much. I go by junkster (from junkmail) ... now there's a name people ought to dislike!
Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. (KJV)
11:37 AM, September 03, 2007
Great Idea, Ima. I went to my trusty Lexicon to look up some Greek:
Beseech:
parakaleō
par-ak-al-eh'-o
From G3844 and G2564; to call near, that is, invite, invoke (by imploration, hortation or consolation): - beseech, call for, (be of good) comfort, desire, (give) exhort (-ation), intreat, pray.
Mark:
skopeō
skop-eh'-o
From G4649; to take aim at (spy), that is, (figuratively) regard: - consider, take heed, look at (on), mark.
Divisions
dichostasia
dee-khos-tas-ee'-ah
From a derivative of G1364 and G4714; disunion, that is, (figuratively) dissension: - division, sedition.
Offenses-this one is interesting. The Greek is the root word for Scandal
skandalon
skan'-dal-on
A “scandal”; probably from a derivative of G2578; a trap stick (bent sapling), that is, snare (figuratively cause of displeasure or sin): - occasion to fall (of stumbling), offence, thing that offends, stumbling-block.
Doctrine
didachē
did-akh-ay'
From G1321; instruction (the act or the matter): - doctrine, hath been taught.
Avoid-has two Greek references
1. ekklinō
ek-klee'-no
From G1537 and G2827; to deviate, that is, (absolutely) to shun (literally or figuratively), or (relatively) to decline (from piety): - avoid, eschew, go out of the way.
2.apo
apo'
A primary particle; “off”, that is, away (from something near), in various senses (of place, time, or relation; literally or figuratively): - (X here-) after, ago, at, because of, before, by (the space of), for (-th), from, in, (out) of, off, (up-) on (-ce), since, with. In composition (as a prefix) it usually denotes separation, departure, cessation, completion, reversal, etc.
to all,
While "chasing rabbits" may be an unwanted distraction, it serves as an opportunity to address particular people over particular issues. Without such exchanges an open forum meant for dialog becomes only a monologue, or even worse, a soliloquy.
gmommy,
I think you must have misread my usage of the term "immorality" in my post. It was used in the context of the actions of SG in past pastorates and their general reasons, not in direct reference to PW's crime. I was in no way minimizing or softening what PW did. I was trying to point out that PW is not the central issue in what's happened at BBC, but the culmination of a string of blunders...although it certainly should have, by any reasonable standards, been the coup de grace to the current administration. Hope that clarifies things.
junk,
I believe you have misinterpreted "gmommy's" comment. I think she was merely suggesting we could come up with a more "colorful" screen name, not that there's anything wrong with "housewife's" profession. Maybe something like "house ewe"? :-)
Billie wrote:
"Place yourself for a few moments as satan."
I thought you'd already done that for us. It's really not very nice calling your fellow Christians "tools of Satan" and the like.
I'm nominating Ms. Billie for deaconess. She's just as qualified to be a deacon at BBC as many who are serving now.
And besides, I'm sure she'd sign any covenant with Bro. Steve.
New BBC Open Forum said...
junk,
I believe you have misinterpreted "gmommy's" comment. I think she was merely suggesting we could come up with a more "colorful" screen name, not that there's anything wrong with "housewife's" profession.
What do I know about screen names? :)
Maybe I have, but I think you may have misinterpreted mine. I didn't say Gmommy thought there was anything wrong with the profession; I asked why she didn't think it was good enough for housewife to identify herself by that "job status" (which Gmommy herself said).
Yeah, she suggested a more "colorful" name, but there would be no reason to suggest it (repeatedly) unless she didn't like the original one. People generally don't go on about things that don't matter to them. Just like it matters to me that the name "houswife" might be judged uncolorful or unsuitable. Smacks of undue prejudice to me.
But, again, what do I know?
Hey aog,
I know your heart and what you meant and your post was right!
It was the word incident. Very minor, I know, and all is well.
Everytime that word was read by DC the night of the bogus report, my body reacted.....
I know you would never minimize the crime that was done. :)
Junk,
Quit fussing at me.....
I had to deal with the "little missy" JUNK last week too many times.
If you would ever bowl with me, you would know that I have the highest respect for being a wife and mother. I loved every second I was home with my children.
My intent was to affirm our blog friend...not to put down.
In my world that particular title didn't inspire the respect due such a noble(and sacrificial) life.
just thought with the quick and creative minds represented here we could come up with a name more fitting (and colorful)for our friend than housewife.
But she can go by fiddle dee and she's cool in my book....just wanting to affirm.....
I'm cranky today...junkie....on holidays, it is a tradition in my life that things break or flood or blow up.
Today was just another holiday in this gmommy's life:)
In order not to cry...I get in fight mode......so.........
.
"Place yourself for a few moments as satan."
oc says:
That's probably not the best advice I've ever heard from a Sunday School teacher.
Just sayin.
oc.
Here we go again.
billie said...
Hindsight says the decision was NOT the correct decision but an understandable mistake for which Brother Steve has more than suffered enough.
Suffered? PW's son suffered. The women PW exploited while "counceling" them suffered. SG didn't suffer. It's called "consequence."
He has learned some very painful lessons but haven't we all, "been there" and he has done NOTHING worthy of having to leave the ministry.
No! I've never harbored a pedophile. So, NO! I haven't "been there."
And yes!! Harboring a pedophile is worthy of having to leave the ministry.
If he wasn't harboring a pedophile, why did he keep the admitted pedophile on pay for 6 months after confessing? Sounds like harboring to me.
God HAS NOT called any of you to participate in the, "organized crime against our pastor"
Organized crime? LOL! Of course you have to say that. It's not exactly convenient to have to admit that we're just telling the truth about SG. It's easier to blame us for the problems. Remember Hillary Clinton accusing the GOP of the "vast right wing conspiracy?" We all know that was baloney too!
BTW, how do you know that God hasn't called us to stand for truth against SG's lies and Bible twisting?
If anything, I could likewise say that God hasn't called you to defend a liar, a twister of Scripture, a harborer of a pedophile, a fence-jumping trespasser, a bully of his flock... Yes, I'm talking about SG.
Yes! many are refering to the blogsters, the savingbellevue website and the IDC as, "satan's organized crime against Dr. Steve Gaines" I agree with them.
Of course they are going to attack the truth seekers. "Vast right wing conspiracy." Of course you agree with them. You're just as voluntarily blind as they are. Considering the source, your collective protests mean nothing.
Place yourself for a few moments as satan. What would be the best scheme you could come up with to destroy a man who God is using...
How about you place yourself as Satan? Speak for yourself.
What would be the best scheme you could come up with to defend a man who twists God's Word and is using it to beat up his flock and destroy a once great church family?
We are living in a day of great confusion for the body of Christ but those who are faithful will come through refined like pure gold.
Interesting that you should say this. Do you mean like the confusion SG and JA caused when lying about what really happened in the meeting? And yes, MS and RE did come through refined like pure gold when they produced PROOF of SG and JA's lies and cleared their names. Thank you for pointing that out.
Remember Judas, kissed Jesus, he pretended to be a man of peace but all know that he had actually became a member of, "organized crime" who claimed to be perfectly keeping the laws of God.
You're describing SG. He pretends to be a man of God while abusing his flock and his church family. He pretends he's keeping God's laws and doing His work but behind closed doors, he breaks the law, gives money to apostate churches, harbors a pedophile, bullies and lies about his sheep, twists God's Word (wait, he does that in public), etc, etc, etc.
I'll stay with the teachings that have more than proven themselves to me over the past 50 years which are exactly what our new pastor teaches.
If this is your sad attempt to equate SG's teaching with AR's teaching, you must have not paid attention when AR was preaching.
To call Brother Steve a false teacher is placing a multitude of people, teachers, pastors, friends, family members in the same category and this woman who you all so graciously love to call crazy, knows better.
Uh, Yeah! Exactly. If you would defend SG after all of the proof you've been presented with, you are in the same guilty multitude!
I ask myself why I bother to talk with any of you
You came here out of your own free will. You can keep coming back or leave out of your own free will. I'm not asking you to stay or leave either way. This isn't my blog and I won't make such requests. But you came here voluntarily. And we voluntarily call you on your nonsense.
New BBC Open Forum said...
junk,
I believe you have misinterpreted "gmommy's" comment. I think she was merely suggesting we could come up with a more "colorful" screen name, not that there's anything wrong with "housewife's" profession. Maybe something like "house ewe"? :-)
1:46 PM, September 03, 2007
LOL. House ewe? Not bad. =) Here are a few tidbits about my name. I really DO love being called a housewife. I don't like "stay-at-home mom." It's a veiled attempt at political correctness. I can't stand political correctness. Besides, there's nothing politically correct about what I do; neither should there be about the name.
Also, I LOVE watching the reaction of feminists when they hear me declare myself a "housewife." HA. They look like they are deeply offended. I may as well have punched them in the stomach; such is their reaction. One lady tried to convince me I should use "domestic engineer." I was hoping she was kidding. It was clear that she wasn't. How ridiculous... and funny. =)
Anyway, I just want to make it clear that I love my name. It would be interesting to read your suggestions for a new name. But it has to be a good one! ;)
Housewife: I always favored the title "Homemaker." As a homeschool mom as well, I thought it adequately conveyed what I did.
:)
gmommy,
Oh my, this will get me in trouble!
How about "Dust Bunny"
EEEEE! I'm ducking....
I'm going to my room.
All I can say it that our children are not safe around Miss Billie. She thinks protecting a child molester is not a crime and no big deal. She thinks it is a 'mistake'.
OC was just sayin:
"Place yourself for a few moments as satan."
oc says:
That's probably not the best advice I've ever heard from a Sunday School teacher.
Just sayin.
oc.
4:12 PM, September 03, 2007
SOTL SAYS:
ROFL!!!!! BHOK ( banging head on keyboard)
gmommy said...
Junk,
Quit fussing at me.....
Awwwww, gmommy, I didn't meant to be fussing! I'm sorry. :( I was "just sayin'" that "housewife" ain't so bad. Seems we agree, so all's well.
gmommy wrote:
"I'm cranky today...junkie....on holidays, it is a tradition in my life that things break or flood or blow up."
She ain't kiddin', junk. Today she had something break and flood!
Padroc,
you better duck!
Junk,
Your sense of fairness is refreshing to me most of the time...
kind of annoying today...
but I'm sure that's due to the holiday FUN I had today.
I certainly do not want to be guilty of undue prejudice against a blog friend. Thank you for keeping me straight.
The fact that Housewife wears her name proudly is all I need to know!!!
I personally did not like the name ...wasn't married to my house...and it was used to put me down.
But hey, Our Housewife knows who she is and the name is a BANNER to her rather than a put down so GO GIRL!!!!
just for fun...and keep in mind, I can't think of anything creative for myself...
politically incorrect HW
unobstructed HW (got that from "open")
Premium HW (got that from Prize)
other adjectives that came to mind....."called" (profession)
wise HW(from lawyer)...she makes some nice arguments...
devoted (from motherly)
fruitful (from productive...not a favorite)
Primary HW ("original")
don't be so serious junk.
Housewife...I bow to you.
NBBCOF: I'm glad you asked my opinion on matters to discuss. Lets go back aways and quote your own words. " This forum was created to provide a place where those who are seriously concerned about the issues facing BBC can come to comment in a respectful christian spirit." You went on to say, "the purpose of this blog is not to confront sins affecting us individually but sins that affect us congregationally."
I never have felt that Miss Billie was an issue facing BBC. Even if she is totally wrong in her theology, she doesn't deserve the blasting or attention she receives from some on here.
Now if the blog is to be an internet social club, maybe I am in the wrong place and would have no problem in bowing out to provide space for another.
I was under the impression that a forum was a place for discussion and comments, not a place to attack others for their views. There is more strong preaching on this blog then is being heard from many pulpits. A kind loving spirit will reach out to others much better than the one who trys to impress with their knowledge of the Bible.
gmommy said:
"I'm cranky today...junkie....on holidays, it is a tradition in my life that things break or flood or blow up."
NASS said:
She ain't kiddin', junk. Today she had something break and flood!
oc says:
Praise God! Nothing blew up! ;) Count your blessings, name them one by one,...
amazed,
You make some good points, but you still didn't offer any specific suggestions.
This blog has been in existence for nearly a year. Some of the people here have grown close and even socialized in person, so there will occasionally be some socializing here. I don't know why that's offensive.
It's not a matter of "bowing out to make space for another." There aren't a limited number of "slots." If you want to start a new topic of discussion or participate, feel free to do so. But please extend that same courtesy to others who post here as well.
gmommy said...
don't be so serious junk.
Heh heh. Gmommy told me not to be so serious.
Serious now.....
the children aren't safe at BBC.
The importance is on SG...not the spiritural nurturing of the children.
The rote prayers (is there another way to spell that)
is so not appropriate.
Even my redneck daddy wouldn't allow us to pray written prayers.
The emphasis isn't on the tried and true safe coaches or teachers for the kids but on who will sign...who is loyal to SG.
The proof that the Sr Pastor and his "leadership"
do not revere God's Word makes the chilren not safe.
The fact that SG promotes his version of the Bible to get around the parts he doesn't obey or sees as just guidelines is a very fearful thing.
The way that he incorporates the world into his own life and sermons is sad and not a safe thing for children.
The fact that he is not loving, humble, sacrificial, or truthful is just scary.
fogmachine said...
Seeing Steve Gaines advertise for his Holy Land gig in the middle of the church service just prior to his sermon is sickening. Since he has admitted to making money in the past and he still benefits financilaly off of the trips, I wonder if anyone else in the church could purchase advertising time or be given advertising time for favors. Perhaps we'll see an Arnold Fisher commercial soon in the service for anyone needing engineering work.
Fog,
Over 300 people signed up for the trip but only 80 were accepted and the trip was sold out on the day it opened up. If a person was in it for money why not take them all. This is what is so disturbing about the things you say in your hate mail. You could get up your own group, if you could find some people to follow you, and make a lot of money yourself.
It is none of your business if Brother Steve makes money off of these trips or not.
My husband and I just returned from an Alaskan Cruise with Turning Point where over 200 people attended. Dr. Jeremiah told us that he had just returned from a Holy Land trip where he carried over 600 people. WOW! How much money would that be?
These comments you all make are so stupid that it doesn't seem possible that anyone could take them serious.
There is a wise saying that I think you have heard recently, "Every story has two sides and somewhere in the middle is the truth" Well the TRUTH stands in the middle of this situation and one side has grace to stay faithful to BBC and submit to the leadership of the Pastor, the other side seems to have grace to go and find another church home.
Both have grace so why not just appreciate what we have, thank God for it and move on to encouraging one another in the ways of the Lord?
You people HATE Steve Gaines with a passion which is so contrary to the very Word you claim to obey.
Every anti Gaines person who we have encountered through writings or personal contact can be characterized by slanderous speech and obvious obsession with rumors and gossip.
People who take pleasure in bad news have a serious spiritual problem but I suspect that most of you would run out and celebrate if something awful happened to the Gaines family.
If I could copy the pictures off of the threads that IDC uses to mock Dr. Gaines, I would paste them here. It is sickening to read the postings of people who find them amusing and entertaining.
Something is wrong with the picture! People please do what you keep saying that BBC should do! Open your eyes and look at yourselves in the picture. (It is a very ungly picture)
NBBCOF: Whats wrong with going back to the basics? The issues at BBC are still there. Why not spend time trying to convince former and current leadership that something needs to be done to bring the secret operations of the church out into the open. To me the best approach yet was the way First Baptist Church, Eulis, TX. solved their problem. And I'm here to tell you, Claude Thomas had a lot more friends in high places in the SBC than Steve Gaines will ever have. It can be done but a group of people that know the inside story have to step forward and take a stand.
junkster said:
gmommy said...
don't be so serious junk.
Heh heh. Gmommy told me not to be so serious.
oc says:
That's funny. I don't care who you are. :)
just laughin'. :)
oc.
Billie wrote:
"...the other side seems to have grace to go and find another church home."
Or "if you don't like what one man has done to a whole church, leave," right?
"If I could copy the pictures off of the threads that IDC uses to mock Dr. Gaines, I would paste them here."
What on earth are you talking about?
Gmommy,
That's quack.... “Mrs. Noah.”
Like I mean, I quack myself up.
I know what manic/depressive means but what is it called when I'm hysterical/serious?- I'm swinging back and forth today. Ooooooo I came up with my own answer..... Billieitis.
Ya know, I can tell God loves a good joke.... look at me.
Gmommy, I am truly sorry that this day has had some less than charming events for you.
But you know if your name was Doris Day you could sing "Now
>ThisDay is Over" and go to bed.
Thank God for tomorrows and “agains”!
amazed said...
I never have felt that Miss Billie was an issue facing BBC. Even if she is totally wrong in her theology, she doesn't deserve the blasting or attention she receives from some on here.
Seems to me that most of the discussions raised by Billie's posts and the comments directed toward her are about the issues facing BBC. Most of the time the focus is on SG--his actions, mistakes, sins, ctimes, sermons, fitness as pastor, etc. No more comments are directed at her personally than she directs at others, but even then the context is most often regarding her support of SG.
::dressed as a concession guy at a ball game::
Duct Tape! Duct Tape! Get your duct tape here! Good to wrap your head around when you read things so asinine its makes your head explode!!! Get your duct tape here folks!
Hey Billie,
I thought you gave the key to the gate away so you wouldn't come here? What happened to that one?
Junkie and sweet cakes,
PLEEEase click your heels together 3 times and say....there's no place like home, there's no place like home....
Doing a great job but relax for a little while.
Dr Pepper time!!
padroc said...
Ya know, I can tell God loves a good joke.... look at me.
Lynn Says:
He did create the duckbilled platypus.
amazed wrote:
"It can be done but a group of people that know the inside story have to step forward and take a stand."
Well AMEN! What do you think we've been trying to get those very people to do for over a year now? Problem is most of them just want to "move on" or they don't want to jeopardize their positions or they don't want the goon squad jumping their fences... there are a whole raft of reasons, I'm sure, but until those "in the know" reveal what they know and take a stand... or just reveal what they know to someone who will take a stand, what can we do? Most of them are attending GBC and Faith and other churches now, and they left us effectively "holding the bag." I heard of a former staff member recently saying he had enough information to "bring down Steve Gaines tomorrow." I say, if that's the case, then why sit on it? If you aren't going to use it or give it to someone who will, then... excuse me, but please just burn the evidence and shut up about it!
If you know any of those people and have any influence whatsoever, then by all means, start pushing!
"There is more strong preaching on this blog then is being heard from many pulpits."
Now that is scary.Are you saying that is a 'bad' thing?
" A kind loving spirit will reach out to others much better than the one who trys to impress with their knowledge of the Bible."
I am afraid I do not understand. Are you saying that quoting scripture here is really something sinister where people are really trying to impress others?
My friend, What is unloving about pointing out the truth of scripture? Is it not the most loving thing we can do?
padroc wrote:
"Ya know, I can tell God loves a good joke.... look at me."
Yeah, and it goes a long way towards explaining why He'd make something as nasty as a nose and hang it upside down over your mouth.
Okay, back on topic now, everyone!
OC,
counting away... you are so right! Todays little fun time was nothing compared to the last Labor Day,this past 4th or the Christmas the hotwater heater exploded!!!
I am a blessed gmommy!....but I do think I will leave the country the next holiday.
Junk,
you got me on that serious crack :) :)
Ms Billie,
"If I could copy the pictures off of the threads that IDC uses to mock Dr. Gaines, I would paste them here."
I'm SO confused......
...I think a great way to end this lovely holiday is with chocolate ...for dinner!!!
Sometimes whan nothing makes sense......ya just need some chocolate....and a DP!
OC, Junk....
made me laugh!!!! :)
Padroc,
singing....!!
I don't remember this ...
but my 86 year old 9th grade English teacher I love and still talk to says that I told her(WAY back then) I wanted to be like Doris Day!!!!
She thought it perfectly logical....thank God for teachers!
gmommy,
You wanted to be blonde?
There is more strong preaching on this blog then is being heard from many pulpits. A kind loving spirit will reach out to others much better than the one who trys to impress with their knowledge of the Bible.
My question is if you take away knowledge of Bible truth, then what are you reaching people with? By what standard would you compare idea to idea and discern what is right or wrong? That's the problem now...a complete disdain for sound doctrine and a heavy reliance on feelings. There's a lot of talk about being Christ-like, but which Christ is being referred to? How can anyone know what it is to be Christ-like without Him being revealed in His word? You can't separate God from His word.
Funny Nass....
Doris day is probably not blonde herself... but good one!
My teacher thought I saw her as wholesome...all American girl...bla bla bla
Que sera sera.
Amazed: There is strong preaching here, and it's a good thing. The accountability here demanded from other believers is an element missing from most churches today.
The issues facing BBC are facing many churches today: sexual sin, a CEO mentality; unfit leadership; false teaching; church members there for reasons other than to worship.....and the list goes on.
The PDL mentality, the seeker focus, the casualness of worship....all have damaged our churches to the point that there are so few biblically solid churches left.
We must stand up for the cause of Christ and pray for every person who comes to this blog. BBC is a microcosm of Christianity as a whole.
IMHO, of course.
"My teacher thought I saw her as wholesome...all American girl...bla bla bla "
Sure. It was probably more about Rock Hudson before we found out he...er...was not 'Rock Hudson'.
New BBC Open Forum said...
gmommy,
You wanted to be blonde?
You mean she's not blonde? :)
(Sorry, Lin!)
"Que sera sera."
How did you know how to spell that? NASS? Give it up...it was your favorite song, wasn't it!
Lin: Scary, isn't it?
Lin wrote:
...it was your favorite song, wasn't it!"
Well, I remember The Doris Day Show, and it wasn't in reruns. :-( Of course, I bet you and "gmommy" do, too! Remember Nelson?
I think Que Sera Sera would be a good theme song for BBC now. Maybe Jamie could do a jazzy version.
'Well, I remember The Doris Day Show, and it wasn't in reruns. :-( Of course, I bet you and "gmommy" do, too! Remember Nelson?"
I know noz-zing!
(Doing my Sargeant Shultz impression)
I am embarrassed to say I DID watch all the Rock Hudson and Doris Day movies:(
I also watched Oral Roberts and dreamed of being one of the singers
(hiding my face)
My best friend from first grade (we still talk too!) gave her money( we use to send CASH)
to Billy Graham...
I sent mine to OR......
I still have songs on the album memorized!!!!...yes....the round thing...
Junk thinks I'm serious (and "blonde")
(nass, how do I stick my tounge out!)
but my previous life was mostly mushy, dreamie, gulible,optimism....yuk.
Lin,
Nass won the State Spelling Bee in Mn.!!!
In visiting over at the blog that shall remain nameless, I have a question. A certain poster is determined that even those on this blog that knew of thePW story before it "broke" should have been arrested and is as much in trouble as SG. I would think that those that knew of the abuse....from a first hand source....would be the ones accountable.
Is this correct, or no?
Nass,
ROTFL!!!!!!!
King Nass could study his spelling trapped in his parent's basement...what else do you do in Minnesota in the winter?
concernedsbcer,
There were those who were never on this blog who knew and reported it to DCS before we learned about it. By the time we found out, the investigation was already opened. It's like calling 9-1-1 for an ambulance. After two or three people have called for the same incident, what's the point of a dozen more people calling?
You know, you really should be more selective in your choice of reading material. :-)
Nass: Yeah, I know....I try not to venture over there, but every now and then, like when GMommy referred to it tonight, I go take a peek. Then I remember why I don't like to go over there. It's very "dark."
Well, well everyone is having such a delightful time while I was hunting and pecking and I almost missed it all.
I have been busy composing a response to a question asked by "Amased" but maybe we don't need for me to be so "heavy" just now. Oh well, I'll go get a Cherry Coke and some choclate chip cookies and think on that for a while. Then maybe I'll post my response.
Ohhhhhh, someone is going to be mean about Csbcer now.....
I didn't know about what PW did to his child until the Friday before it was announced at BBC.
A couple I had told what PW did to ME over 5 years ago called to tell me. I called 2 deacons immediately...neither were officers.
One knew nothing but made calls and found out.
The other already knew because of the hushed conversations going around BBC.
I thought only WW, JF, the wife,and SG knew on or around the same time that the victim forced the issue and PW had to confess to SG???
What did I miss???
Who else knew except friends the victim chose to tell???...friends... not ministers who sheperd a church.
I remember going back on the blog since I started later than some and seeing a post by someone telling about it but it wasn't before DEC.??? Was it????
concernedSBCer said...
King Nass could study his spelling trapped in his parent's basement...what else do you do in Minnesota in the winter?
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Play hockey, of course. :)
shepherd...(sorry)
Cherry Coke...Mmmmm ..sounds tasty.
Did Junk get worn out?????
Cakes.........................(calling)
I still get tickled thinking about that crazy night we were all being silly....
the Baptist jokes....
piglet attacking the squirrel in the attic with hair spray and a broom...and Lin's remark about that!!!
3 babies in 3 minutes
and Cakes'kidney stones getting scholarships!!!!LOL
francesca,
have you posted before???
your name seems familiar but help me!!
Amazed,
And readers across the states and around the world,
Perhaps my thoughts may be of interest…. Maybe not, but the time for organizing has come and gone. There was a season for standing, gathering, and meeting but that seems to have passed. Of course there could always be someone who might come forward with some devastating information and there would be a significant number who would rise to the occasion and assist.
My opinion is that God or Satan, (whichever, depending on your understanding and appreciation of the facts OR your determined conviction regardless of the facts), has sent the "inerrancy, infallibility and sufficiency of scripture" people to other fellowships to serve the risen savior, Jesus.
We have been impacted by "whatever" for two years now, and people, one family at a time, had to decide how best to protect their families and in what church environment they would train up their children in the way they should go. We have deacons and hundreds of teachers with many years of service who have left to serve elsewhere. I think God is making very good use of His children and each family’s monetary contributions for His glory in other fellowships whose God is Lord. There are churches all over the Mid-South giving God thanks for the blessing these tried and true families are to their membership.
The “old Bellevue” has been something like unto a “boot camp” for many years while churches all around “hungered” for the “trained”, to be released for service in their churches.
I have it on good authority that for many, many years the pastors of the churches in this area prayed for some of the families of Bellevue to come and serve in their churches. Now, their prayers have been answered. The community of believers is better for this. The community of churches will be stronger because these individuals are well equipped to lead and counsel others in “thus says the Lord”….. Period.
In my opinion there is almost no obvious reason to stay at Bellevue and keep trying to right the wrongs. It is no secret that whatever is left to be done will be done by God. My concern is that the truth like a tree will come crashing down one day and those who have refused to “stop-look-and-listen” will then know what many of us knew all along. Each of us came to The Cross a personal way and each of us will come to the truth of what is happening in our midst at Bellevue Baptist Church, likewise. How ever each of us comes to the knowledge of the truth in these matters, God will have His way sooner or later.
No matter where we are, as Christians our call is to proclaim Jesus as Lord to the glory of God. Let’s just get after it and quit procrastinating or hesitating!
And to those who seem so self destructively determined to “rearrange the chairs on the deck of the Titanic” as they hold on to their mistaken beliefs about what is and isn’t happening at BBC, we who are broken yet stronger must be ready and willing to be like tender angels of mercy when the time comes for the “tree of truth” to fall. We do love our brothers and sisters in Christ and we will go to any lengths to tend to their “wounds”.
Blessings,
Padroc
"But I have a "special" folder where e-mail from certain... uh... sources... automatically goes so that I never have to see it."
Is that why yu never answer my emails???
Memphis
Paddie,
well spoken....
No, memphis. You aren't on my "list." You've never written anything to me in an e-mail that I thought needed a response. All I've ever received from you are comments.
For the record, I've always published your comments.
Good night blog friends!!!
concernedSBCer said...
Housewife: I always favored the title "Homemaker." As a homeschool mom as well, I thought it adequately conveyed what I did.
:)
5:16 PM, September 03, 2007
Homemaker isn't as "correct" as stay-at-home mom. But it's still leaning that way. Housewife is as politically incorrect as you can get. And that's why I love it.
BTW, I homeschool too. =) Kudos!
padroc said...
gmommy,
Oh my, this will get me in trouble!
How about "Dust Bunny"
EEEEE! I'm ducking....
I'm going to my room.
5:36 PM, September 03, 2007
HA!!! That's a good one! But I rarely dust, remember?
gmommy said...
the name is a BANNER to her rather than a put down
That's a great way to put it. I never really thought about this particular point. But Banner is very fitting. I like that.
Housewife...I bow to you.
7:40 PM, September 03, 2007
Thank you. That's very kind of you.
BTW, those were very interesting suggestions. I did notice one thing though: Isn't "politically incorrect HW" redundant? I do like that it drives the point; in case someone doesn't get it the first time, it says it twice. =)
billie said...
Every anti Gaines person who we have encountered through writings or personal contact can be characterized by slanderous speech and obvious obsession with rumors and gossip.
Be specific. What rumors and gossip? From what I've seen, you've never been able to actually give any examples of this. If I'm wrong, this is the time to give examples.
By contrast, SG did admit to gossip and spreading rumors. One example of this can be read in the minutes of the meeting. As a matter of fact, another example of SG's gossip and rumors (AKA LIES) is the very reason why those minutes had to be published in the first place. SG was outright lying and spreading gossip and rumors about what happened in the meeting and he had to be exposed as the liar he is.
I suspect that most of you would run out and celebrate if something awful happened to the Gaines family.
8:44 PM, September 03, 2007
That is a horrible thing to say! It's hogwash and you know it! You have absolutely NO basis for saying this except hatred on your part (by you) for those of us who would dare expose a liar! We have presented you with REAL cases about SG. You, in turn, come back with false generalities. And then you accuse us of hating SG and wishing something bad would happen to him! Wow. Perhaps you're projecting and you're the one who wishes something horrible would happen to us!
That's low, even for you billie!
HW,
You must have a young one you get up with since you are posting at 2 AM!!! :)
I bow to you again!! I don't know HOW I lived thru the 18 months one of mine took to sleep thru the night!!!
Wonder if Nass took his boat out this weekend up in Minnesota. Shouldn 't be too long before he can go ice fishing again. Maybe we can have our next clandestine meeting up there at his cabin on the lake.
Hey, I've never been ice fishing! Sounds like a truthseeker road trip to me!
:)
Housewife,
There was a time many years ago when I longed to be able to hold the position of housewife. It was then, and is now, a noble calling that cannot be filled on biological traits alone. I was even a bit jealous of those who rightly laid claim to it.
And then the time came when I joined that wonderful, elite group. I put my professional career on hold and I proudly and lovingly referred to myself as a housewife. Like you, I was frequently amused by the reaction of others, especially former professional associates and those of the fema-Nazis persuasion. But oh, how I loved those years of being a housewife! They were the happiest years of my life!
So, for what little it’s worth, I love your name!
Mary
Its good to know you are a man. And all this time I thought you were a woman.
Now maybe you should grow some balls and take this filthy site off the internet.
I've been told that "brady" wrote (in another place)...
"I have a hard time understanding how people can write such hate-filled posts on the anti-Bellevue sites and then delude themselves into thinking they are so spiritual and discerning. I guess the saying is true, 'they can't see the forest for the trees.' Imagine what Bellevue would be like if these people spent as much time praying for Dr. Gaines and in making our church better as they do in writing their garbage.
"Another thought. 'Cakes' is a Buddhist (and that's his right) but the Bible clearly teaches that an unregenerate man cannot even begin to understand the things of the Spirit of God so why do people accept him as an authority on anything.
"Just having a hard time understanding all of this junk."
Yeah, I'm having a hard time understanding, too. Shall I publish all the others, "brady"? I just got around to checking my "special" folder a couple of days ago, and I see you've been a busy little beaver -- writing all those lovely thoughts. Tell me, do you consider yourself "spiritual and discerning," too? Or even a Christian? Not saying you're not because only you and God would know that, but one certainly wouldn't assume that from the things you've been writing!
NBBCOF,
I would like to request that Brady's 12:02 post be removed. I would seriously consider banning him from this site for the leud manner in which he posts. Vulgar would be a better term.
Thanks,
Ima
Padroc,
I’m playing catch-up here…
My words to Cakes on TBR give you a “bubble bath”? That’s funny -- you gave me quite a chuckle with that one, my friend. Love it! ;-)
Mary
We need to pray for billie and fast for brady. Filthy... takes one to know one. I know it's an old one from grade school. But it's so fitting! BTW, isn't brady classy? I hope I have 10 just like him!
gmommy - I didn't realize what time it was. 2AM, 2PM, same difference. =)
mary - I am glad to join the company. =) I'm not a new member of the housewife corporation, but it's nice to find other associates. =)
Nass,
This is ol' mild manered accomodating padroc here. Let us all be ever so tenderhearted in the spirit of gentleness and love with sweet brady.
It is my understanding that he is in the running to become the new mascot for all that is right at our beloved Belevue. You can tell he has his campaign in full swing by his choice of words. Go brady! Go man! Go!
Brady said...
Its good to know you are a man. And all this time I thought you were a woman.
Now maybe you should grow some balls and take this filthy site off the internet.
JTB: I guess you and charles page are on the same "page". You both post crude, and uninformed posts. At least you haven't posted a vulgar & graphic post like charles did on MB's blog. At to Mike's credit, he removed it quickly.
If this site is soooo filthy, do you always make it a habit to view "filthy" sites? Makes one wonder what other really "filthy" sites you like to view?
Do you pray to God with such crudeness?
Brady: I am offended and apalled at your 12:02 post. I am certain, there in your pious little place, that what you wrote would not be acceptable if anyone else wrote it.
You, sir, speak with a forked tongue and you should be ashamed of yourself.
It's folks like you that make the church's work even harder. We have to convince unbelievers we aren't all like you. A Christian's walk and life should be different than the world, not part of it.
Brady, Brady, Brady ...
Do you kiss your mommy with that mouth, little boy?
New BBC Open Forum said...
Billie wrote:
"...the other side seems to have grace to go and find another church home."
BBC WROTE
Or "if you don't like what one man has done to a whole church, leave," right?
BILLIE WROTE
"If I could copy the pictures off of the threads that IDC uses to mock Dr. Gaines, I would paste them here."
BBC
What on earth are you talking about?
8:56 PM, September 03, 2007
Billie writes
You paint pictures in the minds of people with your threads and the people who join in with your mockery and, "informative information" add to the picture.
Such as: The ungodly, satantic "anonymous letter" written with intent to destroy (murder) the Pastor.
You bypassed the deceitful person who wrote it (covering up his wickedness) painting a picture for readers to overlook the true the actual sinner. Every thread that you bring up for discussion is done the exact same way. yet you say,
"We have a duty to point out sin especially when it involves our church"
Some on here have stated their concerns for the people I teach?
Talking about a, "snow job"
BBC and savingbellevue has done a snow job on folks, but praise God some are coming to realize it!
Maybe it is because they have teachers like me who can read behind the lines and recognizes who is really condesending in their hearts.
People remember everytime BBC points their finger for you to look at Brother Steve they are really saying don't look at me or this or that! ==="DON'T LOOK AT THE PERSON WHO WROTE THE ANNONYMOUS LETTER (DECEIVER) LOOK AND SEE IF YOU CAN GET SOME JUICY INFORMATION OUT OF IT TO USE AGAINST STEVE GAINES"
Billie says
YOU HAVE BEEN PRESENTED SOME
TRUTH AND FACTS ABOUT BBC ARE YOU GOING TO WHITEWASH IT?
This just in...I just aged 20 more years!
Just found out my great neice is about to have a baby girl. She's due Oct. 18.
Is there a world record for youngest great great uncle? If so, I'm probably it! lol.
concernedsbcer said...
It's folks like you that make the church's work even harder. We have to convince unbelievers we aren't all like you. A Christian's walk and life should be different than the world, not part of it.
3:48 PM, September 04, 2007
Concerned, thank you for saying that. I was about to respond to brady, but you said it simple, yet to the point. :).
Seriously, if I was a non-christian and saw behavior like that of Steve gaines, brady, billie, and their ilk, I wouldn't get near a church with a 10 foot pole.
Billie,
Since you have insisted that you are under the authority of you husband, does he give you carte blanche to make these statements?
Do you write these under an anointing of the Holy Spirit?
Do you 'bathe' your writings in prayer?
Do you believe that you will be judged for every careless word you write?
Has your husband ever taken his spiritual position of authority in your home?
Ummm ... Billie ... "BBC" stands for Bellevue Baptist CHurch ... I think you meant "NBBCOF" (the initials for this blog. Or was that a Freudian typo?
Ms. Billie,
I know you and I have had our differences, but you must admit, I've always been straight with you, right?
I am telling you the absolute truth: NASS has NO IDEA who wrote the anonymous letter. I have NO IDEA who wrote said letter. JIM HAYWOOD/SAVING BELLEVUE has nothing to do with this blog.
Those are 3 truths that you can bank on. Please stop confusing the issue and just listen to me for a hot second. If we knew who wrote the letter, don't you think we would have told you by now? With as evil as this blog is and with has much gossip that we talk about, don't you think this "anonymnous letter caper" is too juicy for us to keep quiet?
Miss Billie, I have a copy of the letter; would you like me to fax it to you if you haven't received a copy? You seem to have the notion that it's full of lies, but have you read it? Be honest - have YOU read it? If not, you have no leg to stand on in your supposition that it's an anti-Steve letter. The letter is full of spiritual truth - if these truths are not what Steve said in his "unity" sermon, that's not our fault. One person (the anonymous letter writer) has expounded on the sermon and has brought up some good truths. That's it - end of letter.
Please email me if you would like me to fax you the letter.
Don't zing me - I've been nice to ya!
karen
My heart is breaking. The blindness, hypocrisy and false perceptions are more than my mind can wrap around.
Prayerless preachers =
Powerless pulpits =
Problem pews =
Pathetic people.
Explains alot, huh?
_________________
Billie said....
Some on here have stated their concerns for the people I teach?
Talking about a, "snow job"
BBC and savingbellevue has done a snow job on folks, but praise God some are coming to realize it!
Maybe it is because they have teachers like me who can read behind the lines and recognizes who is really condesending in their hearts.
JTB: Billie, Billie, Billie...your pride is exalting you on a pedestal which you seem to be eager to bow down to. You have placed your self equal with God, Billie.
IS THAT THE BLASPHEMOUS THINGS YOU TEACH THOSE UNDER YOUR "CARE"???
You say.."like me who can read behind the lines and recognizes who is really condesending in their hearts." YOU CAN READ PEOPLES HEARTS BILLIE? FUNNY, THE BIBLE TEACHES (NOT THE BIBLE YOU USE, EVIDENTLY) THAT ONLY GOD KNOWS THE HEART OF PEOPLE!!!
So lets see, Billie thinks she is a bible "teacher" who thinks everyone is "coming around" because she can decifer peoples hearts and see motives. How prideful.
Billie elevates herself with God to know the heart of people when God said that He is the only one who can know the heart of a person.
Humm....sounds like Bellevue has a lot more trouble than Steve.
Billie, Satan has done a snow job on you and if you are not careful, you could end up in a place where the snow will melt very quickly.
Billie, if we were to printout all your posts here and all the emails that you sent us, not a church in the world who is serious about the Bible, would allow you anywhere near their people.
I would think God wants the key back Billie.
Brady,
Bless your heart. You just can't help it. You open up your mouth and those foul words just fall right out. You are an innocent victim. Just ask Billie Tapp.
But I do want to thank you for your spirit- filled post. You have certainly edified the Body of Christ with your kind words.
I know that Jesus was proud of what you wrote.
lynn,
The world's youngest great-great uncle should get his own apt! :)
karen
Karen said...
lynn,
The world's youngest great-great uncle should get his own apt! :)
karen
4:54 PM, September 04, 2007
Good Point! :)
Sad thing is, my great neice is 8 months pregnant and no one even told me till today lol.
This is a really confusing day.
I had not read the entire letter because I already saw a break down of how the unity sermon was not scriptural...
besides I heard it preached 2 other times at Baptist churches (same dumbed down outline)...
Now I read the letter and I don't see anything about murder towards SG at all.(Ms Billie 's post)
I also don't understand what I am missing about the "sinful" person that wrote it....I know Ms Billie thinks he is a deceiver....(altho all the things in the letter are things that have been said before and most have been proven)...not any new info the letter writer dreamed up.
So what does the letter say that indicates the person writing has a sin to cover up and is covering his sin by writing the letter concerning SG's "mistakes"?????
I don't get this brain teaser.
gmommy wrote:
"I don't get this brain teaser."
Nor do I. Murder?! Really! Don't you believe you're being a bit melodramatic, Ms. Billie? Not to mention untruthful. I've never heard anyone express any ill will towards Steve Gaines or his family. You need to learn a new song. This one's getting old.
Nass and GMommy: What's worse is that it's a "7-11" song...you know....sing the same 7 words 11 times?
I don't like it at church and I don't like it on the blog.
Try a new tune, Ms. Billie.
brady, if you possessed the specific male anatomy that you referred to in your post, you would have been able to be forceful in your statement without saying something that would make your mama blush. Grow up.
Brady,
Email me. We have things to discuss.
Just sayin'.
oc.
AGAIN, Mrs. Billie Tapp
The kindest thing a friend could do is to tell you the truth in love. Dear lady you are NOT listening! I am sure that my own view of my self and who I am in Christ is imperfect, so I do not expect that my understandings or statements made here will be perfect. With that in mind, I refuse to be convinced that I am right about many things. However, the more I review and examine the content of "the letter" the more I am convinced that you would do well to study carefully with an open Bible the examination of Dr. Gaines statements made by the anonymous writer. I took no pleasure in reading or examining the statements made, but after a few days I had to set aside some time to examine the claims which were so “in-your-face”. Point by point the author PROOVED that Dr. Gaines used pieces of Scripture as pretext to make HIS point.
I do not love you because I have to. I love you because I get to. And I can not in any way love you or anyone else apart from the love of God who loved me first and somehow finds a way to love me still. So it is in that attitude of love that I again say, that you are not listening. Even if you can not believe a single word I have written and am going to continue to abide in your understandings and beliefs as you have shared on this blog; I will not ridicule you for that. I will however continue to appeal to you to “stop-look-and-listen”. There is a “tree” of truth which will fall and I do not desire for you or anyone else to be anywhere near this “tree” when it crashes down.
I don’t know who I think I am saying all this….. Should I be wrong, I already know that there will be a day when I will give an account to God for every idle word I have said and written. May God have mercy on us all!
And I repost the following for reconsideration:
padroc said...
An excerpt I found particularly instructive from the "Anonymous Letter":
"Read Mt. 11:20-23, 15:3-12, 16:21-23 and Luke 11:29-54. Christ created disunity many times in many ways with many different people. His main area of disunity was with the religious leaders. Those from whom “the anointing is to flow to the people.” Because Dr. Gaines gave only one side of the unity issue, he labels everyone who disagrees with him, as being worldly minded and devoid of the Holy Spirit. This is pretext at it’s worst - using the Bible to beat up those who disagree with you and who cannot respond because the attack is made in a sermon from the pulpit. If Christ came to create disunity, how can Dr. Gaines say disunity is a sign of spiritual immaturity? He cannot – in any degree of honesty. In Mt. 10:34-36 and Luke 12:49-53, who is the spiritually immature – Christ or Dr. Gaines? It is obvious at this point that Dr. Gaines is using this sermon to try to silence anyone and everyone who disagrees with him. Dr. Gaines is trying to recruit supporters who will, in turn, try to silence those who disagree with him."
Karen, I think you are correct. Now does seem like the time when those who have been careful, tenderhearted, long suffering, and patient, must stop wrestling with the possibilities and "face the music". We are to follow Christ AND we are to have leaders, who we can imitate, (Paul instructed the Corinthians: “Imitate me, just as I also imitate Christ.” I Cor. 11:1), so as to learn the correct way in which to follow Christ. We are to "support" leaders who are the best examples of following Christ so that we can with confidence recommend their obedience, as an example, to each other and especially our children.
Those who have “held on” may continue for a while, but so many more, having considered the content of Dr. Gaines’ messages and then studied the scriptures like never before, will lead their families to safety.
Please remember that we are to pray for one another…. Leave no one out on purpose. Pray scripture carefully, especially for any one who preaches or teaches scripture out of context.
My life’s desire is that what ever I think, say or do be done to the glory of God. I encourage no one to follow me or my ideas…. Follow Christ and make sure you serve and worship where you can be led to follow Christ in absolute obedience to the whole council of the word of God. Period.
Oh for the love of God my Father, may each person who reads this be like minded in Christ according to every word of God while rejecting every personal/subjective addition to the scriptures, which will appeal to their fleshly unredeemed nature. Amen
Padroc
10:58 PM, August 28, 2007
Billie wrote:
"BILLIE WROTE
"If I could copy the pictures off of the threads that IDC uses to mock Dr. Gaines, I would paste them here."
BBC
What on earth are you talking about?
"Billie writes
You paint pictures in the minds of people with your threads and the people who join in with your mockery and, "informative information" add to the picture."
Except for your unfortunate choice of the word "mockery," thank you for the compliment. But would you please, for the hundredth time, get it through your head that this blog is not IDC, and IDC is not associated with this blog? Nor is this blog "associated with" the Saving Bellevue site and Jim Haywood or Mark Sharpe or Josh Manning, or any other organization or individual. There is no "us." I don't know why that's so difficult for you and a handful of others to understand.
billie
I find it amusing that you think we are doing a snow job on people.
Our Sunday School teacher is probably STILL saying all this is about the music. He was a deacon officer at the time and told his class an outright lie. He had to admit there was alot more to the story once we found out.
The leadership is LYING on a reegular basis- to protect their postions of power. This is the SNOW JOB. Either it has worked on you or you are part of it.
So which is it?
Brady- I guess my grandmother was right. Using strong language is a sure sign of a weak mind. Learn to express your thoughts without profanity.
gmommy said...
francesca,
have you posted before???
your name seems familiar but help me!!
Yes, I have posted a couple of times, but I have been reading for months. I seem to have problems posting so mainly I just read. I was born and raised in Nashville in the SBC (where else??) and have been blessed by Dr. Rogers on TV. That is the reason I checked out this blog in the first place.
Now, I am in Colorado where the PD trash seems to have taken over, even in my formerly right-on Evangelical Pres. The large SBC churches here started this stuff years ago. I have no where to go to church! I hate it. So this past Sunday, I watched Dr. Rogers then drove into the mountains. I have the Bible on CD. I heard part of Nehamiah, all of Esther, and most of Job. I KNOW it is not as good as going to church, but I'll try again Sunday.
Couldn't resist the ice hockey comment for all you Southerners.
from John MacArthur, 2 Cor 6:14
"And to make matters worse, into their midst had come false teachers who brought a syncretistic eclectic kind of religion that took Christianity, Judaism and the most popular forms of pagan idolatry and melted it all together to form a false and satanic and damnable heresy which had had a great influence in the Corinthian church to the degree that some of the Corinthians had even turned against Paul in favor of these false apostles and lying teachers who had come with their doctrine of demons, their satanic concoction and now they were trying to link Christianity with this new stuff and link Paul with these false apostles and such was an absolute and utter impossibility. And more than just being impossible, it was frighteningly damaging, as we shall see..."
Francesca,
Thanks for responding!!
So sorry the world has taken over the churches there too.
Was the Presbty. church a PCA????
I don't know much...very new at this but the PCA in Memphis and in the North where a relative of mine lives, is the conservative/Traditional church.
We have at least one Presbty. church in Memphis where I visited that was a combo of Catholic and New Age....I get nervous when I hear the word "mystical" in church.
Hope we can give you some support.
Many of us are currently or have been refugees.
If you have trouble posting, Nass can walk you thru anything.
He is the King!!!!
I can do ya'll one better. There is a church in Memphis that had a sermon title that had profanity in it. Kenneth Whalum Jr. Yes, the one on the school board had a sermon a while back titled "Jesus Says Bring me that...." I won't repeat the actual word, but its the synonym for a mule.
And BTW, Billie, before you say I'm lying, I have the actual picture of the church sign.
This is a warning to any member of Bellevue Church who may be attending Bible Fellowship and or attending the Sunday performance.
If you want to protect yourself and your family from false teachings, please remove yourself from that place immediately.
Miss Billie is actually not that different from most teachers and staff members who continue to teach and serve under the authority of Steve Gaines and company. They are accepting of the new trend that Bellevue Church is going.
You can't help but become infected from the regular association of apostates. It's a dangerous thing to know things are not right but continue to subject yourself and your children to such. Being silent pretending everything is ok is wrong.
There are many teachers at Bellevue Church that are not willing to stand up for what they know is wrong so they are slowly becoming like Steve because he is not changing.
For Heaven's sake, run as fast as you can and flea. It's obvious things are not going to change. Protect your children and get them as far away from there as possible.
I would like to offer a word of encouragement to anybody who is searching for a church home. There is life after Bellevue!! If you have not visited Faith Baptist Church, you may want to consider it.
In the service this past Sunday morning, Brother Danny denounced the Church Growth Movement and the whole seeker sensitive approach. We are not supposed to conform to the world. We are commanded to love one another, and we are to come to church prepared to GIVE of ourselves – not to GET something.
In the evening service, my family and I participated in the Lord’s Supper for the first time at Faith. In his comments, the Pastor told everybody that if you should ever visit a church that has watered down the Gospel – and does not talk about the blood of Jesus, the suffering He endured for all of us, His death, burial, and resurrection -- then they are not preaching the Gospel. It was refreshing to have a great message from a Godly man of integrity.
Gmommy,
Thanks for your kindness. No, my church (I haven't left yet as there is nowhere else to go) is an EPC . . . Evangelical Pres. The denomination was formed over 25 years ago when the regular PCA became too liberal. Churches here lost everything in doing this . . . buildings, furniture even hymnals. And now look what is happening! It's all beginning again. And to make matters worse, my church is the church designated by the Presbytry (sp) to be the TRADITIONAL one in this city. It is at the same time enraging and depressing. I need an Excedrin!
Sorry for the bad link...too many w's and not enough z's
Try these:
John MacArthur, 2 Cor 6:14 part 1
John MacArthur, 2 Cor 6:14-16 part 2
John MacArthur, 2 Cor 6:17-18 part 3
John MacArthur, 2 Cor 7:1 part 4
Nass is the owner of the blog. He lives in Minnesota and goes ice fishing, even in the summer. Occasionally, he flies down here for clandestine meetings with those of us lucky enough to be included by means of a very high tech super duper synchrinized watch.
Nass is in no way associated with any other organization. He is just by himself, living in his parent's basement, with his bed and his computer.
WHAT is so hard to understand about this?
John MacArthur part 2
"You see, the false teachers wanted to make Christianity more popular, less demanding, less distinct, less narrow, less offensive, less different, less exclusive so they'd get more people in on it, so they could get more money, which is always what false teachers want...."
So sorry Francesca....
I hate that for you. I hope you will get to know us a little better...the regular truthseekers....maybe not some visitors.
I apologize for the ugly language today.
It's so strange to me about the PCA in different areas...remember I am new to the Presbty(I can't spell it either!)
Lin thought of the PCA as the liberals also...the USA are more the liberals in Memphis.
The small church I have been visiting along with another blog friend has been so Biblically sound and the minister is so sweet and loving about people from other backgrounds.
I hope you have some family or a few good friends to encourage you.
We all need to help each other in this difficult time.
As I tell my kids...
"it ain't getting any better!"
Hey!! It's prettier there!!! You can go to the mountains!!
I've been trying to find "Walton's Mountain" on the map for a while...is it there????
Andrew! Oh my goodness....that's it in a nutshell...so sad.
The leaders at Bellevue seem to believe that they can command trust and demand loyalty. The whole idea of having Leadership Covenants is actually quite unnerving.
If you disagree with the leaders, you are a trouble maker. If you can’t agree to support the senior pastor, staff, and church leadership, you can no longer coach at Bellevue, and you can no longer serve in any leadership capacity -- at Bellevue.
In Bullet point # 4 of the Leadership Covenant, it states:
“Support the Senior Pastor, staff, and church leadership.”
Interestingly enough, a now-former BBC coach asked if he could change the wording as follows:
“Support the Senior Pastor, staff, and church leadership, as long as they act in accordance with God’s Word.”
Scotty Shows and the Recreation staff said NO.
So…is it just me…or does that seem really odd that an ordained minister would object to the phrase “as long as they act in accordance with God’s Word?”
Which is our guiding light -- the Word of God or the word of a man?
Psalm 43:3
"Oh send out thy light and thy truth: let them lead me; let them bring me unto thy holy hill, and to thy tabernacles."
Facts, your forgetting....BBC Leadership doesn't follow The Master...instead....Steve Gaines, a MAN, is the Lord and Master at Bellevue. Of course they don't want to follow the rules laid out in the Bible.
Francesca,
You have a beautiful name.
I was out in Colorado last summer for the AFA graduation..it was so pretty out there.
I was raised as a Presbyterian. In 1992, I was made aware that the Presbyterian Church USA was pro choice. I was sickened...I called the pastor and asked him about it and listened as he danced a jig, not knowing where I stood on the subject. After he hemmed and hawed a while, the bottom line was that they were pro choice. That sickened me even worse.
About that same time, our daughter, who was in the first or second grade, had gone to vacation bible school at BBC. So as we became familiar with BBC we went to hear Dr. R. preach. I knew after I heard him preach that if I had asked him the same question that I had asked my Presbyterian minister, he would have told me EXACTLY what he thought about abortion and what God has to say about it, " without fear or favor" as he so often would say. He would not have danced a jig.
Shortly thereafter, we joined BBC.
I wish now that I could have those 15 years again at BBC. I miss Dr. R. I miss what BBC used to be.
Could SS and JJ POSSIBLY so much more concerned with their JOBS than they are for what they were CALLED to do???
I have a friend...only goes to SS then Faith...she says that is the only reason they are hanging on.
If that is what SS said in your presense....then my friend is wrong about him.
Within any structured denomination you will find both conservative and liberal churches. The PCA is on the whole a conservative denomination. It, along with the OPC (orthodox presbyterian church) were formed from a break-off from the PCUSA, when it began it's liberal slide. Just a couple of names from the PCA...RC Sproul, and Ligon Duncan, pastor of 1st Pres. in Jackson, MS. Google the name Greshem Machen, the founder of the OPC...he was a stalwart defender of conservative Christianity.
Note to "Jack Bauer"...
If you have something to say to someone personally... say it... personally, not here!
Fogmachine...
Good advice. I pray people will listen to what you are saying. And by the way...there is a name for what you are describing...it is called BRAINWASHING! Hegelian Dialectic...divide and conquer. I pray for all of you.
Ima
Is it me or does it seem like Bellevue's been putting more tv ads out since Gaines arrived than Bellevue did before he came?
Andrew said...
John MacArthur part 2
"You see, the false teachers wanted to make Christianity more popular, less demanding, less distinct, less narrow, less offensive, less different, less exclusive so they'd get more people in on it, so they could get more money, which is always what false teachers want...."
11:20 PM, September
Billie writes:
BBC Open Forum asked me to explain what I was talking about in a previous post regarding, "painting pictures" I selected the above post but I could have chosen every post which claims Dr. Rogers as their hero or those that claim Dr. Gaines is a false prophet (teacher). Please read the following very closely:
IDC, BBC open forum, and savingbellevue have joined forces to prove that Dr. Steve Gaines is a hypocrite and is NOT a man sent by God to Bellevue Baptist Church.
The, "picture that their statements have painted to thousands of people"
normally begins with how much they loved Dr. Adrain Rogers and how they trusted his word, his theology and his teaching capabilities. If they had stopped there, his legacy would not have been questioned BUT!!!!They organized and opened the doors to expose the world to doubt his discernment, wisdom and ability to hear from God by attacking the man that he loved and considered to be most capable to carry on the work that he had spent over 30 years doing.
For those who have followed the situation, you can see that they feel they are much wiser, much more discerning, and are God's gift to our society than Dr. Rogers, Dr. Gray Allison (founder of Mid America theological seminary, Dr. Johnny Hunt and countless other great men of the faith. Great men who fully support Dr. Gaines. What is really sad is for whatever reason the Roger's family, has supported the picture that is now painted of Dr. Rogers.
They would have you to believe that Dr. Gaines has brought shame to the legacy of Dr. Rogers but the truth is their poor choices and discernment have done the damage.
They would have us to believe that not only was Dr. Rogers a fool for recommending Dr. Gaines, who he knew personally for a great number of years and loved to listen to him preach, but he was also a fool for having placed PW, a child molester, on staff.
I want to speak to all of the people who now have doubts about our former pastor Dr. Adrian Rogers, who can not speak for himself. Dr. Rogers was a great man of faith and he was very wise; sound in judgement. He was deeply loved and respected. He was a man in close contact with the Lord.
I and countless other people refuse to allow this, distorted picture painted by the mixed up minds of a small number of people,
destroy the legacy and theology of living by faith; trusting God with the leadership of our Church which Dr. Rogers left with us.
I believe Dr. Rogers was, not perfect, but exellent in godly wisdom. I believe PW was and is a Christian who fell into sin and attempted to cover it up. I believe our Pastor is one of the finest, most godly men in our country who made some mistakes while under the demands of thousands of people who were telling him when where and how he was suppose to run Bellevue.
We watched Dr. Rogers glow with the glory of the Lord as he passed his ministry on to his choice servant Dr. Steve Gaines. Dr. Gaines continues to quote Dr. Rogers, love, support, and protect the legacy that Dr. Rogers left behind. We have a wonderful pastor who loves Jesus with a heart like Dr. Rogers (bold in faith). We can not seperate Dr. Rogers from Dr. Gaines and this web site proves that fact because they are constantly comparing the two men. If one goes down so does the other.
Please do not let the picture that the anti Gaines organization paint in their postings hang on the walls of your heart. Realize that they, like so many of us in the past, have been deceived by satan. These people did not intentionally set out to hurt Dr. Rogers they really thought they were doing God a favor by stopping Bellevue from going through changes and getting Gaines out of the pulpit was their best way to accomplish it.
Many godly ministers, laymen and prayer warriors from Bellevue and other churches all across this country are praying for these people and asking God to open their eyes to the error of their ways.
Think about the picture that has been drawn in your mind!!!
I have been blessed time and time again by the encouraging words from members of our church who tell me how thankful they are for my willingness to take a stand against those who are doing so much to destroy what we KNOW, without a shadow of doubt, is the work of our great and awesome God through our pastor Steve Gaines. I have made many new friends for whom I am grateful. I am not proud to be on this site and at times my flesh gets in the way of what the Spirit would have me to say. Our battle is with our own flesh when it comes to standing up for the Lord. I do not deny my weaknesses, I confess them as sin and ask for your forgiveness.
The best thing that caring people can do for us is to pray for those who have allowed a ugly picture to be painted in their minds, NOT to be discouraged from the faith that we have been taught and continue to teach and actively embrace at Bellevue Baptist Church.
Billie Tapp
I am sorry if I have somehow offended you. I am reposting with the offending initials removed. I hope you will find this satisfactory.
Following is my initial post (redacted).
"The reason you cannot add the requested phrase to the covenant is simple. Even the few posters on this blog cant agree on what Gods word says. It simply opens the door for confrontation. It is better if you teach and follow SBC doctrinal statements which I believe are explicitly based on and adhere to Gods word. What do we do if a coach teaches that Mary is a co redeemer with Christ. Many will argue this is taught in Gods word. I and the SBC however believe this is false doctrine. And please, a simple request, dont insult me by attacking my spelling or punctuation, or twisting my argument. I mean what I plainly say and nothing more sinister. There is no Hidden meaning. I still dont get why it is wrong or I am in some cliqu for refering to Dr. Gaines as "Pastor" I think that is common and it is not a way to pre determine my mindset. Also, A question to __ (you know who you are) Did you lie about ___? (you know who that is) Just a question. Finally, here are a couple of things to consider.
Opportunity may knock once, but temptation leans on the bell.
Quit griping about your church; if it was perfect, you
couldn't belong.
If the church wants a better pastor, it only needs to pray for the one it has.
To make a long story short, don't tell it."
Billie wrote:
"IDC, BBC open forum, and savingbellevue have joined forces to prove that Dr. Steve Gaines is a hypocrite and is NOT a man sent by God to Bellevue Baptist Church."
Okay, Ms. Billie. Let me repeat this for the 101st time. Listen carefully. IDC, NBBCOF, AND SAVING BELLEVUE HAVE NOT JOINED FORCES. PERIOD. Saving Bellevue is one person, Jim Haywood. NBBCOF is moderated by one person, who writes all the topic headings, namely myself. IDC is another group entirely. There have been no joint meetings, clandestine or otherwise, among those groups. I have no earthly idea who wrote the anonymous letter critiquing SG's "unity" sermon. WHY IS THIS SO DIFFICULT FOR YOU TO "GET"?!
"Think about the picture that has been drawn in your mind!!!"
Oh, Ms. Billie! Stop shooting the messenger and for just once, consider the message, will you? The picture you've drawn in my mind is priceless! Somehow that image you try to project, as some wizened little gray-haired woman in support hose and orthopedic shoes, isn't it. Now, will you please stop pilfering the gate key?
Here's an email I received from Brady - He took time to email to tell me what goes on at Bellevue (ie $25,000 to FUMC) is none of my business and that I should butt out. Here's his latest gem:
From: Brady (brady_jock@yahoo.com)
Sent:Wed 9/05/07 10:14 AM
Your zoloft must not be working today. As usual, you are pathetic.
Brady, you seem to know alot about antidepressants of the selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor (SSRI) class - I'm the 2nd person you've accused of not taking their Zoloft. You probably need to up you prescription as well by the tone of your emails and posts.
Brady, are you helping the cause of Christ by being so disrespectful? As long as you continue to email me, I will continue to post your nastiness here, so that all the world can see what kind of treatment the "dissenters" have to put up with. Please notice I have posted your email address - whatever drivel you get via your email can only be contrued as your problem. I also hope BBC leadership sees what junk you're posting and emailing and will get ahold of you but good. You're not helping them at all. As a matter of fact, you're making yourself look foolish.
karen
Billie said:
"IDC, BBC open forum, and savingbellevue have joined forces to prove that Dr. Steve Gaines is a hypocrite and is NOT a man sent by God to Bellevue Baptist Church."
Lynn Said:
Thanks, I need to go to Home Depot and stock up on more duct tape. Billie, how many times does NASS or anyone else have to tell you that all three are SEPARATE ENTITIES WITH NO AFFILIATION TO THE OTHERS? Why can't you get it through your thick skull? My 1 1/2 year old great great nephew can figure it out, why can't you?
jack bauer wrote:
"A question to __ (you know who you are) Did you lie about ___? (you know who that is) Just a question."
Jack, the only __ I know has no clue which ___ you're talking about, so I probably am thinking of the wrong __. I know a couple of ___'s. Perhaps you could e-mail me with the actual name(s) so that if I know who __ is, I can link you up with him/her. It sounds like you've got a bone to pick with this person, and I think you need to discuss it privately. I really hate playing games.
Ms. Billie,
Put the bong down.
Lynn,
Will you pick me up a couple of rolls while you're there? I'll reimburse you at our next joint clandestine meeting with IDC and Saving Bellevue.
...or at least stop inhaling.
Billie,
Are you suggesting that Dr. Roger's own family is doing what you are accusing the rest of us of doing?
You know, the ones that are now visiting at Faith Baptist?
Are you suggesting that they lack discernment in knowing what their beloved husband, daddy, and grandfather would have thought about the way that SG has destroyed BBC?
I'm not sure about this, BUT, I THINK that they knew him better than you did.
NASS,
Does this mean that we are going to have to take turns going out in your fishing boat since we will have all those extra people there?
And what about the ride up there?
That's way too many people to get in the car. I call shotgun!
Starbucks coffee to get me moving in the morning: $4.25
Commercial Appeal newspaper: $.50
Reading Ms. Billie's hillarious ramblings: PRICELESS
Just a suggestion here, but how long do you think posters that refuse to actually discuss matters will stick around if they are not responded to? I know that if I find myself talking to dead-air I hang up the phone. After repeated attempts to make a connection I often just give up (especially if I find out that I have the wrong number).
I don't think what BT wrote is funny or even sad anymore.
I think what she wrote and I copied in the earlier post is nothing short of EVIL.
Yes...I said it EVIL.
I'm off for the day.....
this is just too low for someone calling themselves a believer or for anyone in the SG camp....
this strategy stinks like the familiar stench of the corrupt world of business and politics.
BT and CP (or WH) can have lunch together today and discuss their success.
I inadvertently "rejected" this comment a few minutes ago when I was cleaning out some others. My apologies.
Jack Bauer said...
I do not wish to reveal anyones identity when it is clearly their desire to remain anonymous. I believe to do so would be wrong. I thought the initials were sufficiant to prevent this. Evidently they were not as you did not allow the comment with the initials. I have many bones to pick with __'s comments, but I do not think it wise to do so on this blog or in person. The one thing I would request from her is that she might consider laying off one of the most Godly men I know. His initials are PN. She has mentioned him by name, not initials, so I presume my use of his initials will pass your delete button. He is a good and Godly man devoted to God's calling on his life and I admire and respect him. I believe it is wrong to denigrate someone with whom you disagree on the world wide web. It is a testament to his faith that he has not nor would he consider retaliating publically. I also hate games. I will not be a frequent poster, I may consider responding to comments occasionally, but only as I feel like it. I will not respond to taunts such as
1. FOGMACHINE said "billie jack,
I think you wrote the covenant that "Pastor" has everyone sign."
2. oc says:
Yeah. I wouldn't want to argue with SOTL either. Especially when she's right. And you're not.
Run Forrest, run.
Just sayin'.
oc.
3. LIN said
Jack, Paragraphs are our friends.
And Jack, if you are comfortable with a pastor who ignores scripture when it is inconvenient, you won't find much agreement here.
4. You said
I'm sure I will be accused of nitpicking here, but when someone calls a pastor, the pastor, any pastor, just "Pastor," as if it's a proper name, it makes my skin crawl. I've noticed the opinions of those who do this are usually similar.
5. and lastly, __ said
Jack,
Did you sign the oath?
Just wonderin
Thanks again for the space to express myself.
11:29 AM, September 05, 2007
Guys,
Was anyone in the Sunday night service?
What did you think of the message?
Jack,
1. It sort of sounds like you're speaking about the same __ I know. However, s/he can't think of anyone with the initials ___. So if you really have anything to say about this matter, either e-mail me or e-mail __ directly and reveal who ___ is. Do not throw out accusations like this and leave people hanging. (And yes, there will be an update forthcoming very soon on the alleged fight incident. So don't anyone throw that one in my face. I've been left twisting in the wind on that one just like everyone else.)
2. I can only answer for my words that you quoted. I stand 100% behind them. It makes my skin crawl to hear someone refer to the pastor or a pastor as "Pastor" as if it were a proper name. Example: "Pastor said thus and so.... " I put that one up there with "love on" or "loving on." It's been a personal observation of mine and you can consider it a personal hang-up (which I've heard others express, too), but that's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it.
Your beloved "PN" recently stated to someone that "ace's" bad behavior here was because we "provoked" him. Excuse me? PN was shown written evidence of just how extensive said person's behavior went, and he says none of that matters. He signed the "covenant," and he's a SS teacher (of 6th graders no less) and that's that. I would urge any parent with a 6th grader in that SS department to take your child and run... far, far away!
nathan,
I think it's just a matter of time until we see Steve or Donna perform a "miracle" of some sort -- or be the object of a "miracle." I've heard there's even a "pool" where people are placing bets on when, where, and the nature of the "miracle." (I'm kidding about the pool... I hope, but there are rumors that this will be the next big thing to come down the pike.) Will it be a miraculous healing? Another dream or out-of-body experience like in the Garden of Gethsemane?
I think Sunday night was Phase II.
aslansown said...
Just a suggestion here, but how long do you think posters that refuse to actually discuss matters will stick around if they are not responded to? I know that if I find myself talking to dead-air I hang up the phone. After repeated attempts to make a connection I often just give up (especially if I find out that I have the wrong number).
11:23 AM, September 05, 2007
My experience:
“Mrs. Billie? Hello…. Hello? Any one there? …… Hello….. mmmm? (click)“We’re sorry this number does not accept incoming calls.” (click)
Considering the report on the Sunday night message (linked), I think it is written by someone uncomfortable with this type of thing.
Anyone who has heard SG speak for any given period of time will know he thinks highly of either:
* his prayer life
* the power of prayer
or both.
I visited a SBC church a while back, out of town, that was having communion. During the service, they also had a foot washing. This did not make me uncomfortable or anything but I considered this is what the pastor believed in doing. As far as SG's praying over people for miracles, I personally would not worry unless he started doing the BH or EA thing. To date all we see (or at least all I know about) is that he believes in laying hands on people during prayer and asking for miracles.
As long as we stop with "Your will be done" I don't find fault.
Still looking for a church...
Francesca,
It is good to have you with us.
Ima
Andrew,
These messages from John MacArthur are incredible! I have already listened to all of them. I, too, cannot recommend them highly enough. Do yourselves the favor folks! It is all about false teaching.
Ima
PN stated at Exit 15 that the kids should stay away from this
EVIIIIIIIIIL blog.
If not for this blog, PN, PW, Bellevue's resident sexual pervert, would still be running around, preying on innocent women and children.
Only when this blog made his CRIME public was SG forced to place him on PAID leave.
So, PN, I suppose that it would be better for a sexual pervert to be let loose on our women and children than it would be for people to see and hear the TRUTH that is presented on this blog.
What about the " I had to say what was politically correct" regarding the departure of Rob Mullins? Is this what you teach our children?
Did you stand up for the truth that day?
And WE provoked CS into doing and saying the things he did? Was CS not responsible for his own behavior? Do you teach this concept to our children? It's ok to lie, be cruel, be deceitful, as long as you are provoked into it?
And of course, there is that covenant to SG that you signed.
Except to keep your job, why would you sign that covenant? And if only to keep your job, why not do the right thing and then let Jesus take care of you, and meet your needs? Isn't this what you have ALWAYS taught our kids?
I'm not mad at PN, I'm just hurt and disappointed. I have always had the highest regard and respect for him. He has raised Godly children and has a lovely, Godly wife. I pray that God will remove the scales from his eyes.
I remember a commercial about 20 years ago for Reverend Ike's prayer cloths. You would purchase them from him and put them all over your house..and a miracle would happen.
Is that where we are headed?
LOL...just kidding!! I really don't think that even they would do that!
AslanOwn: I agree.....I've begun scrolling past, unfortunately. Why do I want high blood pressure over someone's CHOICE to ignore the obvious?
NASS:
I would be interested to know why you think a miracle is necessary.
Is there some magic in laying hands on someone? The only place in Scripture that I'm aware of that commands laying on of hands is in the matter of ordination to gospel ministry, and with that comes a warning to lay hands on no man quickly. In James we're told if we're sick to go to the elders to pray over us and annoint us with oil. That's pretty much it as far as I can see. It also says if I'm in trouble, I should pray. We don't need a human mediator to approach God. There's only one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus. The acts of the apostles were unique, that is unless you believe there are modern day Paul's running around. As for miraculous healings...i've never had a problem with that idea...but I have a problem with divine "healers", and leading people to believe that walking among them and laying hands on them has some power which the "fervent effectual prayer of a righteous man" does not. If we're sick and we simply pray for a miracle, yet do not seek the advice of a physician, then we are not only being unwise, but presumptuous as well. Does not God also heal by death? The saint who dies is in perfect health in the presence of the Lord. We're told to ask, seek, and knock. If I need a job it's perfectly right to take that need to God...but I'm also to look for a job...seek and knock. Be careful about allowing someone to lay hands on you...you may get something you didn't bargain for.
Question...Can the spirit of Error be transfered via touch? Or is it a spirit sent directly from God? The Jezzebel spirit?
Megachurch Leader D. James Kennedy Dies
Lynn said...
Billie said:
"IDC, BBC open forum, and savingbellevue have joined forces to prove that Dr. Steve Gaines is a hypocrite and is NOT a man sent by God to Bellevue Baptist Church."
Lynn Said:
Thanks, I need to go to Home Depot and stock up on more duct tape. Billie, how many times does NASS or anyone else have to tell you that all three are SEPARATE ENTITIES WITH NO AFFILIATION TO THE OTHERS? Why can't you get it through your thick skull? My 1 1/2 year old great great nephew can figure it out, why can't you?
10:
Lynn and NASS,
Anyone who clicks on www.info@integritydoescount can easily see the "Seperate" websites who have joined forces (organized) supporting one another. Maybe Lynn's great great 1 year old nephew can help you understand.
We all have painted pictures of one another don't we? We also paint pictures of Jesus Christ in the minds of people who stop, look and listen to words from our mouths. In this area we "ALL" are guilty of sin. Where many words are spoken there is sin.
In the flesh, we are ALL sinners just like the prince of this world.
The overall statements I make regarding the link Info@integritydoescount are correct, the stand I take for the Lord is correct and basically every point I confront is correct BUT in no way do I claim to do and say everything without sin.
You are correct to picture me as a sinner.
I have heard a number of humble godly people admit that they had used some harsh cruel words as they defended their faith; words they wish they had not used. The regret was not in their stand or defense, it was in the fact that their flesh got in the way.
This is my only regret in all of the postings that I have done.
I've yet to hear one blogger say that they have committed one sin and I have a problem with that.
A teacher who stands up, as though, he lives a perfect, quiet, never mess up life is a person who never does anything. I am a teacher and so are you and all believers who claim to know Christ.
I have received some good advice regarding some of the words I have used to describe some of the vocal anti Gaines bloggers, which I have received well. I will in the future refrain from refering to any of you as ___________ of _________.
Billie
Speaking of Ace,
It was reported to me that on his facebook ( or MYSPACE) he had listed as his very best friend as a girl who had just finished the 7th grade.
Is this normal for a 20/21 y/o man?
"Just a couple of names from the PCA...RC Sproul, and Ligon Duncan, pastor of 1st Pres. in Jackson, MS. Google the name Greshem Machen, the founder of the OPC...he was a stalwart defender of conservative Christianity. "
Just to clarify. Sproul was ordained PCA but his church, St Andrews, is NOT in the PCA. That is why he was not disciplined for filing suit on a Christian Blogger who posted information about Ligoneir finances and questionable actions concerning Don Kistler and SDG.
Ligon Duncan's brother works for Ligoneir and has been caught in many lies surrounding the lawsuit and hiring of Private Investigators with donor money to find the blogger. It is widely believed that since RC Sproul, Jr was defrocked, Ligon Duncan may one day take over Ligoneir.
BTW: All of the above practice padeo-baptism.
So, he may have correct doctrine but as Jesus said about the Pharisees, Do what they SAY, not what they DO.
billie said...
They would have us to believe that not only was Dr. Rogers a fool for recommending Dr. Gaines, who he knew personally for a great number of years and loved to listen to him preach, but he was also a fool for having placed PW, a child molester, on staff.
billie, you are such a liar. Yes, a liar! YOU ARE THE ONE THAT SAID AR WAS FOOLED BY PW!!!!!!
You'll want to ignore the following fact as you love to do... Before he died, AR told Bro. Whitmire that he felt duped by SG. SG treated AR very badly in front of witnesses. But by then, it was too late!
The, "picture that their statements have painted to thousands of people"
normally begins with how much they loved Dr. Adrain Rogers and how they trusted his word, his theology and his teaching capabilities. If they had stopped there, his legacy would not have been questioned BUT!!!!They organized and opened the doors to expose the world to doubt his discernment, wisdom and ability to hear from God by attacking the man that he loved and considered to be most capable to carry on the work that he had spent over 30 years doing.
What kind of nonsense is that? How does reminding people that AR was a great man of God put his ministry in question? Perhaps you're projecting. Do you mean, kind of how your defense of SG makes us weary of him even more?
the Roger's family, has supported the picture that is now painted of Dr. Rogers.
The picture that AR was a great man of God? Why wouldn't they support that?
BTW, the Rogers family don't support SG. Doesn't that tell you something? I guess not. You'd have to be discerning yourself to make such a connection. And you have to have your blinders off to be willing to see that they have VERY GOOD reasons (plural) for not supporting SG.
I want to speak to all of the people who now have doubts about our former pastor Dr. Adrian Rogers,
I've never heard of anyone doubting his legacy. Apparently, you're the only one with doubts...
Dr. Gaines has brought shame to the legacy of Dr. Rogers
...but if there are those who doubt AR's legacy, SG would have been the ones to bring it on!
But it's obvious what you're pathetically trying to do. You're trying to take the focus off of SG's failure as a Pastor and trying to AGAIN PUT DOWN AR!!!!! And worse, you're trying to blame us for something YOU YOURSELF ARE DOING!!!! Man!! You just can't help yourself, can you?
None of you can defend SG without putting down AR. Did you really think we weren't going to catch that? Anyone reading this can see it a mile away! You're so transparent.
You really are like Judas Iscariot. You pretend to sing AR's praises in one paragraph and in the next, you're back to your OLD (no pun intended) bad of tricks of putting him down.
What's sad is that you really think that OLD Bugs Bunny trick is going to work... "He doesn't have to shoot you now."
Duck - "Shoot me now, shoot me now."
You really thought we would fall for it, didn't you?
We can not seperate Dr. Rogers from Dr. Gaines and this web site proves that fact because they are constantly comparing the two men. If one goes down so does the other.
You wish!!! As a matter of fact, that sounds like a threat. If we continue to tell the truth about SG, then you'll take down AR with him. That would explain why you can't defend SG without insulting AR's memory. SG can't defend himself without insulting AR! You'd think a real man could stand on his own feet and not have to cowardly put down a DEAD man!
Many godly ministers, laymen and prayer warriors from Bellevue
... have been lied about, abused, intimidated, kicked out, pushed out, called hezbollah, had their fences criminally jumped, been gossiped about, beating and battered with twisted Scripture, etc, etc, etc and have had to find other places to worship where their families could safely learn the untwisted Word of God.
"It is better if you teach and follow SBC doctrinal statements which I believe are explicitly based on and adhere to Gods word. "
You gotta be kidding. There is huge disagreement about the BFM. Did you listen to any audio of the last convention? Do you know how many IMB missionaries have left because they refused to sign off on a specific doctrinal statement? There is a huge controversy over Baptism and Private Prayer Language not to mention many other things.
Billie, You have got to quit watching Joyce Meyer and Jan Crouch.
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