Here we read about a malady that seems to be affecting more and more pastors today, the "Man of God" Syndrome.
Channel 5's latest.
Sometimes you've just gotta laugh!
Thursday, January 18, 2007
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About Me
- New BBC Open Forum
- This forum was created to provide a place where those who are seriously concerned about the issues facing Bellevue Baptist Church and the SBC can come to comment and exchange ideas. Anonymous comments are welcome, but it is respectfully requested that instead of choosing the "Anonymous" option those who want to post comments without logging in select a unique screen name. This lets everyone tell the difference between one anon and another without revealing any personal information. Under the box where you compose your comment where it says "Choose an identity," just check "Name/URL" and type in the screen name of your choice. You can leave the URL field blank. It would be helpful if you'd use the same screen name for any subsequent comments. This makes reading and following discussions easier, helps avoid confusion, and doesn't result in one person being credited for writing something s/he didn't. Comments by posters whose only purpose is to disrupt (i.e. trolls) will be subject to deletion. Your cooperation will be appreciated.
439 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 400 of 439 Newer› Newest»BTW, my last post was directed toward ace, but anyone please feel free to answer.
NBBCOF,
MMMM, since ace had to leave, I got the cookie! Thanks!
karen
I will ask again....Did the adhoc committee answer the advance question?
Hey y'all,
I'm glad we're all praying for PW's son, but please rememer his wife and daughter in prayer as well.
Thanks!
Karen
Excuse me, charlie...
ace wrote:
"1. Jim Haywood hasn't posted on this blog."
"How sure are you of that? Because I have evidence that suggests otherwise. ;)"
Feel free to present your "evidence." I'm just going by what he told me. Of course, I'm sure you'll have some excuse why you can't reveal said evidence. But the offer's open if you'd like to take advantage of it.
NBBCOF
Kare said:
If you will answer Piglet's post - it has some valid questions. For the record - Piglet, please tell me you weren't telling ace to shut up. Or did I read the last part of your post just really wrong.
Piglet's post:
If you knew these things,would you shut up and go away?
Karen:
No,I wasn't telling Ace to shut up and go away.
I meant,if he knew the things I mentioned were fact, or if they had happened to him would he have just shut up and gone away?
I hope he would want to warn our church body about who our pastor really is...
Ace said:
I would love to address Piglet's post but I would rather not because of the way he/she has treated me in the past. He/she will do nothing but argue and attack my response to him/her and I'd rather avoid that right now. He/she will just call me a liar, a troll, and tell me to go away which I don't really want to deal with right now.
Piglet says:
Ace, please show me a post where I called you a liar or a troll. This is the second time you have said I called you a liar. Do you have me mixed up with someone else?
I think you owe me an apology for accusing me of that.
I believe you won't answer me because I stay ON TOPIC and I ask you TOUGH QUESTIONS.
Then I hold you responsible for your answers.
overflowinggrace wrote:
"I will ask again....Did the adhoc committee answer the advance question?"
I don't know if they did or not. I never heard anyone ask them that question. You might want to check the topic heading for a clue though.
NBBCOF
Who did Craig Parker tell the Advance story to? Mark Sharpe
Overflowing grace said:
Did the adhoc committee respond to Brother Steve getting advances?
Piglet said:
Among all the issues,I don't think this one was even brought up with the CC but I could be wrong.
I'm assuming they would tell us it is none of our business, like his salary...
Piglet,
Like I told ace earlier, I have "I just bought a house" head so forgive me for reading that post so wrongly and forgive me for even thinking that. I know you better, don't I? :)
karen
ace said...
Well, Karen, I'm getting off the computer for a bit. Feel free to send your responses my way if you have any, I'll address them when I get back.
9:09 PM, January 19, 2007
Why is that ACE? Where the questions getting a little to hard to answer for ya? Don't ask anyone on here for evidence or to question where they got information if you can't play by the same rules! I know you are used to the rules only applying to us, being associated with the Gaines camp like you are!
***Sorry Charlie! You can take over watching Ace again now!
Democrats can call the President a racist....it doesnt matter if the President is a racist or not. It's the seriousness of the charge. Once the accusation is made the President has to prove that he is not a racist.
I can accuse the Pastor of smoking pot...some people will believe me. Then the Pastor has to prove that does not smoke pot.
Same goes with the salary advances...if there were good solid evidence that would bother me. If it's Mark Sharpe's word alone, my mind is not changed.
Karen:
No problem!
Congrats on the new house!
Shucks,
I just got home. Looks like I missed all of the fun. BUMMER!!!!
I'll have to admit, JIM, oops excuse me, I meant ACE, did pretty well behave himself.
Piglet,
I'm going to have a housewarming once we get moved in - we close on Jan. 29!! :) We'll have cookies and invite ace! He wants to have a cookie social so we can all be friends again and that seems like a good a time as any, huh? Also, it's got a 6 foot fence so if someone comes to visit me, they know to bring their hurdling shoes! Hey, that was funny........
:)
Karen (feeling better after a decent dr. report today - no cancer, no HPV, but endometriosis that can be treated - but I will not attempt a cartwheel tonight!)
Overflowing grace said:
Same goes with the salary advances...if there were good solid evidence that would bother me. If it's Mark Sharpe's word alone, my mind is not changed.
Piglet says:
I've known Mark for some time and I know he has been unjustly cast in a negative light. His word is good enough for me. But if I were to investigate further, I would ask Craig Parker.
Karen,
Praise GOD for your good DR. report.
Karen
Glad things turned out okay for you! I've had a couple of scares myself.:)
overflowinggrace,
I'm just wondering why you're not willing to believe Mark Sharpe? He's been nothing but truthful about his experiences and conversations. Has he wronged you somehow? If so, go to him - I'm sure he'd be willing to make things right with you.
As you name infers, there is OVERFLOWING GRACE for us all!
karen
and thanks to everyone for the good wishes - I am feeling wayyyyy better!
karen
Karen,
I'm glad the doctor's visit went well with good news. :).
I'm undergoing an MRI Monday on my lower back after I hurt it before Thanksgiving on a slippery approach at the bowling alley.
BTW, I called ABC24 about whether or not they are going to continue airing the Bellevue telecast, but the Program Director never returned my call.
New BBC Open Forum said...
Wasn't there some kind of "official" talking points memo the SS teachers were supposed to read to their classes this past Sunday morning? Did anyone's teacher read something like that? Was there any general discussion about "things" in anyone's class?
NASS
-----------------------------------
I am proud of the posters on this blog for ignoring your post trolling for talking points. What "things" were you expecting? You start with a rumour "Wasn't there some kind of..." and then you try to create some chatter that will escalate into another evil plot by Pastor Gaines and his minions "Was there any general discussion about "things"...pitiful.
Your like the guy at the game that's trying to start the wave and everyone's just looking at him.
I agree with Mike's post which is for the forum to adhere to the purpose set by the administrator. Exactly what I requested in my first post to this site that was immediately deleted by Mr/Mrs New BBC.
You will see no changes in this site Mr. Bratton. It's like the National Equirer of Bellevue now.
Karen,
So, in your opinion, how many mistakes will you accept from Steve before it hits your last straw?
It depends on the level of the mistakes and the severity. That's too much of a complicated question to answer without more details and without getting really specific. I will say that he is nowhere close to "hitting my last straw," though.
I'm sorry to hear about your ex-husband and the abuse he put you through.
Steve Gaines kept what Paul Williams told him to himself because in Steve's opinion it was "under the blood".
Okay, forgive me, but where did this quote originate from? Everybody is saying that Gaines said it was "under the blood" - when did he say that and to who? Thanks, I'm really curious.
He should have not kept this issue to himself regardless of how he thought he should handle it.
True, but it should be noted that Gaines already admitted he should have acted on this issue way sooner than he did and he apologized.
He kept it to himself because I feel he wanted to be spared another debacle at BBC - after all the apologizing he'd been doing
At the point of the so-called "confession," Steve never issued an apology about anything so I don't think that's a valid excuse.
NBBCOF,
Feel free to present your "evidence."
Alright.
I'm just going by what he told me.
He views this blog. He sees my posts here and he emailed me about them before. I know he reads them.
Of course, I'm sure you'll have some excuse why you can't reveal said evidence.
And of course you are wrong. Ask Jim Haywood about the new websites he is putting up. That will give you a hint on his username. Oopps, I've said too much. Sorry Mr. Haywood.
Piglet,
Ace, please show me a post where I called you a liar or a troll. This is the second time you have said I called you a liar. Do you have me mixed up with someone else?
I am not going to search through all your posts sorry. If you never said that, then I apologize, I must have gotten you mixed up with someone else. But you have openly voiced your opinion against me on a number of occasions and you love arguing with me.
I believe you won't answer me because I stay ON TOPIC and I ask you TOUGH QUESTIONS.
No, it's because you are mean to me and you love to attack me, that's my one and only reason. I promise you I didn't even read your questions.
Integrity,
Why is that ACE? Where the questions getting a little to hard to answer for ya?
RE: leaving the blog around 9:00pm
Well, there are a number of reasons why I left. #1, I don't spend my life here 24/7.
#2, Numb3rs was on TV. Are you happy?
bug wrote: You will see no changes in this site Mr. Bratton. It's like the National Equirer of Bellevue now."
And BBC is like the Nixon White House.
Karen,
We'll have cookies and invite ace! He wants to have a cookie social so we can all be friends again and that seems like a good a time as any, huh?
Sweetness! I'll be there.
Koragg,
BTW, I called ABC24 about whether or not they are going to continue airing the Bellevue telecast, but the Program Director never returned my call.
I talked to him and the Program Director knew nothing of the so-called "move" because it's not moving.
You need to sign up for a sitemeter. That will show where some of these posts are coming from.
from Bellevue Today for this coming Sunday...
"Please refrain from photography, audio, and video recording
during Worship Services without permission."
I wonder if my sketch pad is ok to bring.
I wonder if they're gonna confiscate our cell phones :p
AOG
Obeying authority.
How does the "recording rule" fit in to scripture?
We didn't obey him or other leadership when they told us to leave if we like it at Bellevue any more either.
karen,
you have email.
ace said...
Karen,
We'll have cookies and invite ace! He wants to have a cookie social so we can all be friends again and that seems like a good a time as any, huh?
Sweetness! I'll be there.
I'm holding you to it! :)
I'm not sure where "under the blood" came from, but it's been a consistent quote atributed to the pastor.
Ok, so it's gonna take something really big for you to get to your last straw" - I can understand that; people have different levels of tolerence.
Steve Gaines and others trespass over a fence in a gated community which he acknowledged was a bad decision, and he badmouthed BBC to the church in Union City which he acknowledged was a bad decision, then he bungled Dr. Whitmire's retirement announcement which he acknowleged was a bad decision, then he gave money to FUMC which he/the CC acknowledged was a bad decision, then knew about the molestation which he acknowledged was a bad decision - when in this timeline of bad decisions did he ask for guidance from someone? (ok, my timeline may not be exact, but the issues are correct) That's a lot of bad decisions and yet he continues to bungle. Why doesn't someone step in and say something? Ace, you seem to be open to listening to me - would you go with me to the pastor to discuss these issues. To be honest with you, he scares the jeepers out me and I don't want to get yelled at (which was Dr. Whitmire's experience) - would you go with me if we can get an appointment?
karen
oops
should have read...
"if we don't like it"
Good Night Neverland
Sweet dreams all
ZZzzz
Karen,
I'm not sure where "under the blood" came from, but it's been a consistent quote atributed to the pastor.
Yeah, but are we sure this isn't just a rumor? Does anybody know exactly where this quote originated from?
Ace, you seem to be open to listening to me - would you go with me to the pastor to discuss these issues. To be honest with you, he scares the jeepers out me and I don't want to get yelled at (which was Dr. Whitmire's experience) - would you go with me if we can get an appointment?
I am not going to bombard him addressing these issues after a service or catch him in the hallways. If you can get an appointment with him, yes, I will go there and sit with you...just to make sure he doesn't beat you up. :) You'll have to do the all the talking. ;)
StillWaiting,
Wow....how are all those parents whose babies are being dedicated on Sunday night going to be able to get permission by then to video and take pics of the dedication?
All the parents of the babies get free DVDs of the service, no worries.
CJesusInMe,
I know.....you can buy a DVD for only 9.99, what a deal! It's all about making money folks, watch and see! I had to buy our daughter's baptism except I think it was more than 9.99!
Again, the families get free DVDs of the service for the baby dedications. If anyone else wants to buy one, it's $7 at the bookstore.
bepatient,
got it and sent you one back!
karen
Errr...my $7 figure may be incorrect. I think that's the staff price. I think it's actually $12 for everyone else. Sorry about that.
Well that's good to know. Wonder about if they take pics? I know they get a pic with the pastor, but what if someone just wanted to take stills of the actual dedication?
Go talk to Jim Barnwell. He'll more than likely give you the permission to take the photos. It's not that hard to obtain it. :)
Paying for a DVD for a baptism or dedication is the dorkiest bunch of hooey I've ever heard of! Are you really serious?? You gotta be kidding me! SERIOUSLY??
karen
Karen,
Scroll up and read my post. If your baby has been dedicated, you get the DVD for free....
CJesus,
Did you pay for your child's baptism DVD? Did they know you were the mom?
karen
Why would someone sell DVDs of people's baptisms to strangers? That doesn't make much sense to me.
Karen,
Did you pay for your child's baptism DVD? Did they know you were the mom?
Everybody pays for their own baptism video....it's always been that way.
Ace refuses to converse with me.
He won't answer my questions.
Piglet said:
I believe you won't answer me because I stay ON TOPIC and I ask you TOUGH QUESTIONS.
Ace said:
No, it's because you are mean to me and you love to attack me, that's my one and only reason. I promise you I didn't even read your questions.
Ace'
I notice you're willing discuss non-issues in order to swerve off topic, and cast doubt on other people's statements.
You can dish it out but you can't take it?
cjesusnme
Were these good questions or not?
(see my 8:34 post)
Koragg,
Why would someone sell DVDs of people's baptisms to strangers? That doesn't make much sense to me.
They put the entire service on the DVD and the baptisms are part of the service.
Piglet,
Thanks for your opinion.
You get the whole service on the DVD
ok now I'm really off to bed
Piglet, If I may jump in here, it seemed all of your questions were "what if" questions.
And personally I do not see any value in discussing what if's. Just a personal, non threatening, non belittling, non strife causing post. :)
ace said...
Everybody pays for their own baptism video....it's always been that way.
Always? Dale Palmer baptized me and I never heard anything about a video - I was 12 and I'm 39 now.
When did this start? You said always, but not that far back always.
BTW, let me think about getting a meeting with SG after we hear about the investigation results. Fair?
karen
Ahh ok. Shoulda clarified that on the beginning :)
Karen,
You have e-mail :).
Hey ace,
If you answer Piglet's questions, we'll break out the CHOCOLATE FOUNTAIN that I got for Christmas at the housewarming and we'll dip the chocolate chip cookies in it!!!
karen
andrew wrote:
"Please refrain from photography, audio, and video recording during Worship Services without permission."
Permission from whom? How much notice do you have to give them? Do they give you a press pass or something to indicate that you're "officially approved"? If they don't, and 100 people were to pull out camcorders (not suggesting people do this, just posing a hypothetical question), what do you think they'd do? Do you think the incident with Jim Haywood just might have prompted this "new" rule? After all, the only "rule" they announced before the SCT was "no flash photography."
Karen,
Always? Dale Palmer baptized me and I never heard anything about a video - I was 12 and I'm 39 now.
I'm not sure if they took videos from back then. Correction - it's been that way as far as I can remember.
When did this start? You said always, but not that far back always.
You'll have an email within 2 minutes...
BTW, let me think about getting a meeting with SG after we hear about the investigation results. Fair?
Fair.
He apologized for letting a pedophile continue being a minister for six months. Doesn't sound like something that should destoy his credibility as pastor--I mean he apologized, for criminies sake.
What do you people want, real accountability or something? I mean, really?
NBBCOF,
Permission from whom? How much notice do you have to give them?
Jim Barnwell. I'm not sure on the notice. Probably on the spot would be fine if you can find it and it's a worthy cause.
Do you think the incident with Jim Haywood just might have prompted this "new" rule?
This isn't a new rule. Haven't we covered this before? It's been a rule for YEARS.
Memphis
All my "What if" items actually occurred. They can't be proven unless everyone with testimony can have a meeting......
I'd just like Ace to admit that these things are important enough to be concerned about, that Mark is not some sinister figure being used by Satan as some would like you to think.
He seems to think all the issues have been dealt with and everything is overblown.
What if he's wrong and Mark has been silenced for a reason? Would he even WANT to know?
Don't worry ..I'm a good little piggie! :) I just don't take no garbage.
I'd like to add-- for all those who currently support the pastor - put yourself in Mark's shoes. What if you knew things and noone would believe you or allow a meeting....
Sorry Bro,
I'm still wondering where I find the truthseekers on Sunday.
BBC E,
Yes, Ace seemingly found some manners.
He/She may not wear out that saved by grace ticket after all. ;D
ace wrote:
"This isn't a new rule. Haven't we covered this before? It's been a rule for YEARS."
Oh, okay. I get it now. It's a rule no one's ever heard of that's never been enforced before. Do you think the incident with Jim Haywood just might have prompted the sudden enforcement of this rule? Or did someone {gasp} get caught selling pirated tapes of a baptismal service?
I taped my son's baptism from up there at the baptistry.
NBBCOF,
You crack me up!
k
koragg,
you sent me email? I don't have it.
Karen
That's good to hear, you guys still spreading lies?
Piglet says:
Apparently.
Yeah, I remember, as a little girl, dreaming that one day I could grow up and spread all kinds of lies at a mega church. It was hard being so good those first 25 years here at BBC. But all the while..planning..and ..scheming....just waiting for the right moment...
BBC Employee,
WHHOOOO way harsh - throttle back a little.
karen
I just resent the e-mail Karen. Turns out I sent the original from my school account by mistake :).
koragg,
got and answered! Karen
Well, I'm sure if you have any kids, you'll want to tell them it's not polite to make negative remarks about someone's appearance or physical characteristics.
Like say.."that pig sure is pink..." and so on. :0'
Where did Ace go - we were having civilzed conversation. It got really hostile in here - BBC Employee, why are you so harsh? Not necessary in my opinion. We were planning a cookie party and everything and the mood just got spoiled.
Karen (pouting!)
Everyone,
Piglet,
I just wanted to mention that the three issues I re-framed as pro-pew/pro-pulpit were for the following reasons:
Accountability ("to no one" or to someone)
Pay ($400,000 or other amount)
Authority ("not a deacon any more" or still is a deacon)
All three of these, Accountability, Pay, and Authority, are matters for an individual church body to seek scripture for and implement policy to the best of their ability to follow the lead of the Holy Spirit.
I just looked over 25+'s "The list" click to see it again
Guess what? Every issue on there is a matter of pro-pew vs. pro-pulpit.
The nice thing about pro-pew/pro-pulpit issues is this: when representatives of both sides sit down at a table (or online), these can all be negotiated. It might take 6 months or more, but it will be an incredible growth opportunity for any church body that puts politics aside and really strives to do this seeking truth in love and in peace.
Good work 25+!
Weekend readings:
Day 20: Exodus 10-12 (Saturday)
American English translation ("NIV")
King James
Day 21: Exodus 13-15 (Sunday)
American English translation ("NIV")
King James
cjesusnme
HAhahaha!
Karen,
Where did Ace go - we were having civilzed conversation.
I'm still here...
Did you see this?
Karen said...
Hey ace,
If you answer Piglet's questions, we'll break out the CHOCOLATE FOUNTAIN that I got for Christmas at the housewarming and we'll dip the chocolate chip cookies in it!!!
karen
Alright, ALRIGHT!
If this is where all this is heading...I am NOT telling my weight on this blog! :@
Karen,
Thanks but like I said earlier, I don't like the way Piglet addresses me so I'd rather not address his/her posts anymore. He/she just wants to argue with me and I have better things to do with my time than to engage in such activities.
Well,if I spend several hundred dollars on a pair of shoes with your tithe money, you have my permission to complain.
A poster with the screen name "sackcloth&ashes" wrote:
"Bellevue has a minister who has been on staff for many years who, while serving on staff at Bellevue, sexually molested and sodomized his own pre-teen son and continued for some time thereafter.
"The son is now of age and he confronted his minister father and the minister confessed in front of witnesses at the church.
"Gaines has known about this for well over a month and little to nothing has been done. Gaines said that it was "under the blood."
*****
I found this in the December Archives.
Piglet,
Well,if I spend several hundred dollars on a pair of shoes with your tithe money, you have my permission to complain.
What are you implying here? That he used the BBC credit card? He used his own personal money for his shoes. Don't start with this rumor again.
Thanks 2006, I knew I had read "under the blood" somewhere other than just making it up in my own head.
Charlie, are you still around? Time to post your disclaimer, but take out Ace's name - he's been very interesting tonight.
Ace, man you're a tough cookie! :D Won't even answer for a chocolate covered chocotlate cookie. You have restraint! ROFL
karen
Ace
I thought you weren't speaking to me.
Try answering my questions,but pretend someone else asked them because I want you to really think on your answer.
(see 8:34 post)
ace,
Did you see this one? I'd really like your thoughts:
Ok, so it's gonna take something really big for you to get to your last straw" - I can understand that; people have different levels of tolerence.
Steve Gaines and others trespass over a fence in a gated community which he acknowledged was a bad decision, and he badmouthed BBC to the church in Union City which he acknowledged was a bad decision, then he bungled Dr. Whitmire's retirement announcement which he acknowleged was a bad decision, then he gave money to FUMC which he/the CC acknowledged was a bad decision, then knew about the molestation which he acknowledged was a bad decision - when in this timeline of bad decisions did he ask for guidance from someone? (ok, my timeline may not be exact, but the issues are correct) That's a lot of bad decisions and yet he continues to bungle. Why doesn't someone step in and say something? Ace, you seem to be open to listening to me - would you go with me to the pastor to discuss these issues. To be honest with you, he scares the jeepers out me and I don't want to get yelled at (which was Dr. Whitmire's experience) - would you go with me if we can get an appointment?
karen
Karen,
I thought I responded to that already? Sorry, it's getting late. Correct me if I'm wrong.
ace, you did answer part of this, but what about the mistakes and apologies and mistake and apologies, etc. Just wondering your thoughts.
Karen
BBC Employee,
Are you the garbageman? Cause you dumping a lot here.
Karen,
I really don't know what else to say about that? I thought I voiced my opinions about how he asked for forgiveness many times before...and I know that's "not the issue" to you, but I don't know what else to say? Sorry.
And Haywood or anyone else can have my cookies instead of me, I don't care.
NASS
Is bbcemployee breaking a rule here?
BBCE
Man,I'm glad YOU'RE not representing ME.
Hey, Steve! Get a load of your support!
Insert Charlie Fox's statement here - just delete Ace and insert BBC Employee...
karen
ace,
Ok, I can accept that - Thanks!
karen
bbc employee,
I know that Jim Heywood (sic) can come across as overly harsh, but I believe he's a good man. I used to sing in the choir with he and Betty, and I'm sure that he is doing what he's doing out of sincere motives. I question his strategy, but I don't doubt his sincerity.
h
NASS
Might ought to delete my 12:18 post so it doesn't look like I'm upset with you.
Because we all know I NEVER get upset with you! :D
Ace,
Did you see my 12:09 post?
"....under the blood."
2006,
I saw it now, thanks. Now the question is, where did they hear it from? I have a feeling that we may have been quoting SG as saying that for the past month or so while he may have never said it in the first place...hmm...
piglet, Karen, maybe you can answer this:
but what is with the members only blog on the Sb website?
Ace
There you go, casting doubt again.
Still won't answer a reasonable question.
Piglet,
Thanks for your opinion.
Memphis
I honestly don't know about the members only blog.
BBC Grow up!
No need for that
Has anyone heard from brother Tim lately? I've noticed that he hasn't posted as much since I've been back.
Tim, are you doing well? You've got a very loud voice, and I hope you haven't gotten discouraged.
ok kids,
after too much dr., too much house and too much blog, I am going to bed.
Trollcates,
email me and I'll let you know where we're meeting Sunday.
Thanks for the conversation, Ace.
Thanks for all the good wishes on my health.
Galatians 5:24
Those who belong to Christ Jesus have nailed the passions and desires of their sinful nature to His cross and crucified them there.
karen
Ace,
You may be right; but when I read that post I remembered it as being the first one that I, personally, had read that had that phrase in it.
That poster did at the time seem to be putting more comments out about the incident than we had heard about elsewhere.
I guess you just need to find out who "sackcloth&ashes" is and ask them directly.
Dee
2006Huldah said...
Ace,
Did you see my 12:09 post?
"....under the blood."
12:22 AM, January 20, 2007
So where did that quote come from?
Was somebody else there 6 months ago?
Why didn't that person report it to the police?
bbc employee said:
I think you should change your name to fart-face
NASS
Are you out there?
I think this bbce WANTS to be deleted.
Goodnight Karen
BBC Employee said...
Piglet,
All I'm hearing from you is:
"I'm a troll! I'm a troll! I'm a troll..."
BBC Employee...change the tone and do more conversation and less trash talk and people won't think your a troll.
PIGLET!!!
NO NO NO NO NO!!!!
FG
I agree.
NASS
Leave the posts for all to see. I can take it. I'm one tough piggie!
FG
I think bbce is attempting to teach us an object lesson.
bbce
Hypocrites hide their problems. They don't address them. If you're not part of us and have a concern for the issues here, then you're input is not needed.
FG,
Take your own advice - oh, I'm supposed to be going to bed, but I was gonna help out Piglet. But you're holding your own...
karen
Karen,
Thanks for your concern :)
I'm going to read and get some sleep.
G'night, Ace. Hope my questions keep you up tonight.
Piglet,
G'night, Ace. Hope my questions keep you up tonight.
Don't worry, they won't. I didn't even read your questions. I just skipped over them. Isn't that great? :) Goodnight.
piglet,
I'm sorry, I misread. I thought you were the one calling bbc employee the bad name. I didn't realise he called you that, and you were just pointing it out.
But still, it really should be ignored. That's so childish it speaks for itself.
I took my inane comments off as well.
ACE
You are now landing on the bright sunny shores of DENIAL.
AOG
Before I put on my jammies, I just want to caution you. I wouldn't be too surprised if someone we all know is attempting to put us on a "guilt trip " for "airing our issues".
You know.."Now,I'll NEVER be a christian because of you guys..blah,blah,blah"
Just don't get sucked in too far.
G'night.
Piglet,
Thanks for your opinion.
piglet wrote:
"Just don't get sucked in too far."
Better yet, just don't get sucked in at all!
NBBCOF
AOG, per your post below, can you expound a little?
allofgrace said...
bbce,
You, me, everybody has to stand before God...alone...no one to point a finger at. Everybody dies for his own sin..no exceptions.
12:44 AM, January 20, 2007
Please tell me that I'm missing something because of other comments that got deleted from the poster who was being rude, or that I am misunderstanding you for some reason.
Thanks,
mjm
Good morning live from BBC,
As a seasoned news anchor and photojournalist, I want to advise all Bellevue members this whole business of not being able to take pictures or video inside your own church is preposterous. I wouldn’t give an Amen for this idea in a million Sundays.
I thought you Baptist thought the church were the people and God owned the church. Is Jim Barnwell and Ace attached to each other? It seems like they make the communication rules around your church. What is the pastor’s take on this.
Jim Barnwell can't make the rules up for your church. I would suggest Sunday that anyone desiring to take a picture, video, or recording to do so. No court of law is going to allow members of a church to be prohibited from taking pictures. I could see it now, “Hundreds of members being arrested at BBC for taking pictures”.
Even I have pictures of myself when I was just a wee little lad on the church grounds and inside the church growing up.
Do the proceeds of the sale of videos go to Jim Barnwell or the people producing these tapes? That might be my next investigative report.
Until next time, remember to always keep a fresh set of batteries in your digital camera and recorder. Live from somewhere inside BBC (not British Broadcasting Company)
Re: Recording at BBC.....this all flabergasts me as the person sitting in front of me at the SCT recorded WITH A VIDEO RECORDER the entire first half of the tree, through the Wise Men coming in. I know this because she was blocking my view! The Usher was standing within 4 feet of her and never said a word. I also have recorded many activities within Bellevue and never had anyone say anything to me. Has there been a change in policy? Or a change in the enforcement of the policy? Or just an enforcement on certain people?
JMHO....consistency is part of integrity......
Good morning again Bellevue,
A question came to mind after reading libertyinchrist that needs to be asked by everyone at Bellevue. Has Jim Barnwell or Ace ever asked our permission to film our faces as we sit in the service? This film is broadcast all over Memphis and now it appears they are selling tapes with our faces shown. Since we the members own this private property called Bellevue, how can Jim Barnwell or Ace take our pictures and sell DVD's without our permission? I think we have more of a leagal cause of action having our pictures sold without permision than Jim Barnwell has against any member taking a picture and not selling it.
The solution to the video issue.
Good Morning all! Hope everyone is refreshed from a wonderful sleep. I got my LWF devotional today via email (lwf.org to request) and got to thinking about amy favorite chapter of scripture: Hebrews 11! Boy if we had this kind of faith! Enjoy and be blessed!
Hebrews 11
1 The fundamental fact of existence is that this trust in God, this faith, is the firm foundation under everything that makes life worth living. It's our handle on what we can't see.
2 The act of faith is what distinguished our ancestors, set them above the crowd.
3 By faith, we see the world called into existence by God's word, what we see created by what we don't see.
4 By an act of faith, Abel brought a better sacrifice to God than Cain. It was what he believed, not what he brought, that made the difference. That's what God noticed and approved as righteous. After all these centuries, that belief continues to catch our notice.
5 By an act of faith, Enoch skipped death completely. "They looked all over and couldn't find him because God had taken him." We know on the basis of reliable testimony that before he was taken "he pleased God."
6 It's impossible to please God apart from faith. And why? Because anyone who wants to approach God must believe both that he exists and that he cares enough to respond to those who seek him.
7 By faith, Noah built a ship in the middle of dry land. He was warned about something he couldn't see, and acted on what he was told. The result? His family was saved. His act of faith drew a sharp line between the evil of the unbelieving world and the rightness of the believing world. As a result, Noah became intimate with God.
8 By an act of faith, Abraham said yes to God's call to travel to an unknown place that would become his home. When he left he had no idea where he was going.
9 By an act of faith he lived in the country promised him, lived as a stranger camping in tents. Isaac and Jacob did the same, living under the same promise.
10 Abraham did it by keeping his eye on an unseen city with real, eternal foundations - the City designed and built by God.
11 By faith, barren Sarah was able to become pregnant, old woman as she was at the time, because she believed the One who made a promise would do what he said.
12 That's how it happened that from one man's dead and shriveled loins there are now people numbering into the millions.
13 Each one of these people of faith died not yet having in hand what was promised, but still believing. How did they do it? They saw it way off in the distance, waved their greeting, and accepted the fact that they were transients in this world.
14 People who live this way make it plain that they are looking for their true home.
15 If they were homesick for the old country, they could have gone back any time they wanted.
16 But they were after a far better country than that - heaven country. You can see why God is so proud of them, and has a City waiting for them.
17 By faith, Abraham, at the time of testing, offered Isaac back to God. Acting in faith, he was as ready to return the promised son, his only son, as he had been to receive him
18 and this after he had already been told, "Your descendants shall come from Isaac."
19 Abraham figured that if God wanted to, he could raise the dead. In a sense, that's what happened when he received Isaac back, alive from off the altar.
20 By an act of faith, Isaac reached into the future as he blessed Jacob and Esau.
21 By an act of faith, Jacob on his deathbed blessed each of Joseph's sons in turn, blessing them with God's blessing, not his own - as he bowed worshipfully upon his staff.
22 By an act of faith, Joseph, while dying, prophesied the exodus of Israel, and made arrangements for his own burial.
23 By an act of faith, Moses' parents hid him away for three months after his birth. They saw the child's beauty, and they braved the king's decree.
24 By faith, Moses, when grown, refused the privileges of the Egyptian royal house.
25 He chose a hard life with God's people rather than an opportunistic soft life of sin with the oppressors.
26 He valued suffering in the Messiah's camp far greater than Egyptian wealth because he was looking ahead, anticipating the payoff.
27 By an act of faith, he turned his heel on Egypt, indifferent to the king's blind rage. He had his eye on the One no eye can see, and kept right on going.
28 By an act of faith, he kept the Passover Feast and sprinkled Passover blood on each house so that the destroyer of the firstborn wouldn't touch them.
29 By an act of faith, Israel walked through the Red Sea on dry ground. The Egyptians tried it and drowned.
30 By faith, the Israelites marched around the walls of Jericho for seven days, and the walls fell flat.
31 By an act of faith, Rahab, the Jericho harlot, welcomed the spies and escaped the destruction that came on those who refused to trust God.
32 I could go on and on, but I've run out of time. There are so many more - Gideon, Barak, Samson, Jephthah, David, Samuel, the prophets. . . .
33 Through acts of faith, they toppled kingdoms, made justice work, took the promises for themselves. They were protected from lions,
34 fires, and sword thrusts, turned disadvantage to advantage, won battles, routed alien armies. 35 Women received their loved ones back from the dead. There were those who, under torture, refused to give in and go free, preferring something better: resurrection.
36 Others braved abuse and whips, and, yes, chains and dungeons.
37 We have stories of those who were stoned, sawed in two, murdered in cold blood; stories of vagrants wandering the earth in animal skins, homeless, friendless, powerless -
38 the world didn't deserve them! - making their way as best they could on the cruel edges of the world.
39 Not one of these people, even though their lives of faith were exemplary, got their hands on what was promised.
40 God had a better plan for us: that their faith and our faith would come together to make one completed whole, their lives of faith not complete apart from ours.
Thanks, Karen. I love this chapter...it is so humbling and encouraging at the same time. Verse 40 is the topping on the cake (or should I say cookie??? ;)
AOG,
Sure, we can let it go. It just didn't sound like you -- wasn't trying to pick a fight, just get some clarification.
mjm
mjm,
be glad you weren't around last night - it was not funny at all. But thanks for the concern - I can see how that post could be taken out of context.
karen
concerned,
I copied it from BibleGatway.com and it's The Message Bible version. Makes it really plain to understand.
karen
From the BBC website:
Please refrain from photography,audio,and video recording
during Worship Services without permission.
This statement does NOT say you are PROHIBITED from photography,audio,and video recording. The definitive word is REFRAIN.
Merriam-Webster definition of REFRAIN: to keep oneself from doing, feeling, or indulging in something and especially from following a passing impulse.
charlie,
regardless of what the policy was, we know darn well it hasn't been implemented until now. I have a tape of the last CC meeting - do you think they'll come and get me??
karen
charlie,
You're right. Words do mean things, and some people may not be able to always "refrain" themselves. Wanna bet we see that message reworded by next Sunday?
karen,
They don't care about your tape. It was just Harry Smith saying, "I don't know. I don't know. I don't know... " Who'd pay them for that? I know I didn't buy it.
NASS
Karen said...
charlie,
regardless of what the policy was, we know darn well it hasn't been implemented until now. I have a tape of the last CC meeting - do you think they'll come and get me??
karen
Do I hear your doorbell ringing???? LOL
It's been policy for a while that you're supposed to have permission from the media office before taking pictures on church property. I used to have to make a request to Larry Thompson's office. It's a security issue, not copyright, and I don't know why Jim was told that.
As to why it was enforced with Mr. Haywood, that should be obvious. He was not a parent or friend taking pictures of a relative being baptized or singing a solo. His purpose was to capture video of the congregation so that he could belittle them and hold them up to public ridicule on his website for all the world to see.
NASS said...
Wanna bet we see that message reworded by next Sunday?
Charlie said..
How's about before the end of the day, if ACE LORD JIM reads my post?
Report from the Personnel Committee
Bellevue Baptist Church
January 12, 2007
This is a report from the Personnel Committee of Bellevue Baptist Church. The committee members are: Aubrey Earnhart, Perrin Jones, Wayne VanderSteeg, and Bryan Miller.
Copied this from bellevue.org. I knew something about this bothered me: What do these 4 men know about investigating abuse? Bryan Miller is an educator and should know some, but he's proven to me to be ineffective, Wayne VanderSteeg is a business man and I don't know about the other 2, but they don't have LCSW or PhD after their names.
I'm just wondering if someone else at Bellevue with better credentials and the know how to investigate an abuse case wouldn't have been a better choice.
Karen
charlie said...
Do I hear your doorbell ringing????
Don't scare me! I am getting overly paranoid these days. Think about that for a second: I'm scared that the leaders of my church will come and get me? How far we have fallen, huh?
karen
Karen said...
Don't scare me! I am getting overly paranoid these days. Think about that for a second: I'm scared that the leaders of my church will come and get me? How far we have fallen, huh?
Reply:
Maybe you should ask the 20 plus families over at GBC that received HOME VISITS?
charlie,
Do tell - GBC members got home visits from their leadership regarding the problems? Seriously?
karen
SERIOUS AS A HEART ATTACK!!!!!!!!!!
BTW, The INVESTIGATION committee is made up of David Coombs, Administrative Pastor; Doyal Long, Minister, Pastoral Care; and outside human resources consultant Mike Stavropoulos, HR Mpact. NOT the personnel committee that you listed
karen,
I think I AM glad I wasn't on last night! Reading all of it after the fact was too, too much.
Have a good day, everyone. Glad you're feeling better, Karen.
mjm
Charlie Fox said...
Maybe you should ask the 20 plus families over at GBC that received HOME VISITS?
11:21 AM, January 20, 2007
Don't worry about any visits to your home. Remember Deacon Pruett has figured a way to delete us without the expense of driving to everyones homes to "share a little love with us dissenters".
Charlie Fox wrote:
"NASS said...
"Wanna bet we see that message reworded by next Sunday?
"Charlie said..
"How's about before the end of the day, if ACE LORD JIM reads my post?"
I said "next Sunday" because this week's bulletins have likely already been printed. Otherwise, you'd be correct.
Good Point, O WISE ONE!!!
charlie fox wrote:
"BTW, The INVESTIGATION committee is made up of David Coombs, Administrative Pastor; Doyal Long, Minister, Pastoral Care; and outside human resources consultant Mike Stavropoulos, HR Mpact. NOT the personnel committee that you listed."
Don't you think Karen still has a valid question?
The Message is not the Bible. Read this short explanation:
http://www.bible-researcher.com/themessage.html
or
http://members.tripod.com/jdlarsenmn/message_problems.htm
Do not trust the message. It is a very poor paraphrase that misleads. There are many other explanations of the problems with The Message. A quick google search will reveal much.
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